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  #21  
Old 06-04-2020, 01:05 AM
paranoidgarliclover paranoidgarliclover is offline
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Originally Posted by mick78 View Post
The 8 series IMO does not really look like a BMW
I agree. I've seen at least one in real life and, while handsome and striking, it doesn't look anything like a BMW and doesn't have the long, lean, sexy look of the Mercedes S-Class coupe or the restrained aggression of the original 8-Series coupe (which I thought was a magnificent exterior design).

The C-pillar issue, for me, actually began w/ the current 4-series coupe, which had been stretched and so steeply raked that the greenhouse looked weirdly elongated (the angle of that backlight would like better on a much longer car, IMO). A BMW design hallmark, IMHO, been a relatively large and upright greenhouse.

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Originally Posted by madskillz View Post
Is it really that bad?
I'll reserve final judgment until I see it in-person, but the pic you've chosen highlights the hood and headlights and keeps the grille shadowed.... So, again, even BMW seems to be a little worried about the grille.
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  #22  
Old 06-04-2020, 07:57 AM
mick78 mick78 is offline
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Originally Posted by madskillz View Post
Is it really that bad?
Compared to the first generation 4 series, or an E92 3 series coupe, I think it very much is; And if I think how the new "The 1" (what a stupid name by the way) and 2 Series Gran Coupe look in flesh vs. pictures, I have really very low hopes that it will be better in flesh ; If anything, I think those FWD Bimmers look even more awkward and cheap in flesh than in pictures; This, at least has a fairly sleek (if derivative) shape, that those fat looking FWD blobs miss. But I have very little hope for the detailing to impress me; The amount of defending that the designer is already doing in interviews just shows me that many feel that way, probably even him....

And as paranoidgarliclover, that fairly tall and airy glass house was also a BMW detail that I really liked and miss in current BMW designs. Probably if they killed that first and the Hofmeister kink later, or other way around, it would be less weird, but killing both fatuzres at the same time just makes teh cars feel very "non BMW" in profile...
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  #23  
Old 06-04-2020, 12:22 PM
exl500 exl500 is online now
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What surprises me is that once I get past the nasty front end, the rest of the car is a mess and a bore. It's like it's actually worse than the grille.
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  #24  
Old 06-04-2020, 01:07 PM
madskillz madskillz is offline
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Originally Posted by mick78 View Post
Compared to the first generation 4 series, or an E92 3 series coupe
When Bangle's E92 came out it also differed significantly from the predecessors and was criticized heavily. Now many people recognize it as the best 3-series coupe ever.
And it's not like new 4-series doesn't have anything in common with it (and they are 15 years apart). Just take a look.





There are some design elements(or maybe ideas would be a better world here) that are quite similar if you take a closer look. Obviously the detailing and C-pillar are the biggest differences, but the area where the fender, hood ,front light and bumper come together has some similarities from this angle. Side skirt is almost the same, also the way center of the door protrudes to the outside(despite character line being lower), then there's a trunk line that slightly falls to the back, and the way the rear is tapered. And finally general proportions(despite new one being longer and slacker at the back). We even have vertical lines surrounding the grill on both cars. Also watching it in motion helps with the general shape and feel of the car - that way you're not focused on overstyled details .So IMO it's not like it's just a mix of other brands designs and there is no BMW dna whatsoever.


I'm not saying all the detailing is great, but overall it's a nice car and even the grill somehow works. I'm really pleasantly surprised by this.
The fact that it's fresh and you can easily tell it apart from other BMW's is a plus in my opinion(otherwise we'd have a million complaints it looked like a facelift of outgoing car).


I just find it weird how inconsistent BMW are with their recent designs:
8-series - fantastic
3-series, X5 - really good
X3, X4, X7, 5-series LCI - ok
X2, X6, 7-series LCI - bad
1-series, 2GC - total disgrace

Those last 2 cars are the ones that should be getting all that hate instead.
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  #25  
Old 06-04-2020, 01:30 PM
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I'm actually liking the overall shape more. It looks more mini-8 when compared, but they screwed up the C-pillar... not sure why they would invert the kink. Takes away from the heritage link and looks less aggressive.

I think the grille is an abomination. The kidneys are amorphous and too rounded. The concept had sharper corners. I don't mind a vertical grille and BMW has done them successfully in the past, but the license plate is a total afterthought. See how it sits so nicely under the grille of the E92?

I found the 2015 Homage concept had a nicely shaped vertical grille because it tapered towards the bottom.

(the SHAPE of the grille, not the overwrought headlights and bumpers)

I would also prefer BMW went horizontal the emphasize width rather than height.
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  #26  
Old 06-04-2020, 03:13 PM
mick78 mick78 is offline
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The E92 was the one Bangle era BMW (actually not designed by Bangle, btw.) was never criticized, as it had really nice proportions, was applauded for abandoning weird details and returning to BMW greatness outside; The interior still was not too well received, bith style and qaulity, tehre it took yet another generation, and actually I'd argue that inside, the currnet 3 series (and this 4 series) are currently on top of the class; Thus it is really sad that the exterior detailing is poor, as the proportions wouldn't be....
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  #27  
Old 06-04-2020, 05:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nicktyelor View Post
I'm actually liking the overall shape more. It looks more mini-8 when compared, but they screwed up the C-pillar... not sure why they would invert the kink. Takes away from the heritage link and looks less aggressive.

I think the grille is an abomination. The kidneys are amorphous and too rounded. The concept had sharper corners. I don't mind a vertical grille and BMW has done them successfully in the past, but the license plate is a total afterthought. See how it sits so nicely under the grille of the E92?

I found the 2015 Homage concept had a nicely shaped vertical grille because it tapered towards the bottom.

(the SHAPE of the grille, not the overwrought headlights and bumpers)

I would also prefer BMW went horizontal the emphasize width rather than height.
much better execution on this concept. would have been an actual beautiful design and had room for a number place below. You're right in that they should emphasize width of a sports car, not height. the 5 series facelift got that right.
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  #28  
Old 06-05-2020, 08:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exl500 View Post
What surprises me is that once I get past the nasty front end, the rest of the car is a mess and a bore. It's like it's actually worse than the grille.

Sleeker through the air it may be, but while the new 4-Series is moving through it, we are least spared the full effect of its visage. Because there really is no getting away from the fact that the new 4-Series does have a very big nose. And while this feature has dominated (what else could such an extravagant proboscis do?) most of the reportage on the car’s design, what is perhaps equally striking (much like the recent 8-Series), is the removal of almost all of BMW’s time-honoured styling features.

What this adds up to is something which borders on blandness; there being almost nothing upon which the casual observer, or indeed the Veirzylinder aficionado can hang his M-Sport jacket upon. Indeed, from some angles (not to its face of course!) one could easily mistake it now for an Audi A5, which may or may not have been the intention.

One man who would know about this is Domagoj Dukec, who now heads design for brand-BMW, under the overall leadership of Adrian van Hoydoonk. Dukec told journalists the massive grille is intentional; there to make the 4 Series look “more emotional” and to divert from the reduction of other key design elements. They always say that, don’t they. One never hears a car designer state that their aim was to make the car look ‘less emotional‘. Nevertheless, one cannot deny that he has been successful in this at least, since the 4-Series certainly has already elicited strong opinions.

Perhaps what we are witnessing here is a new and rather insecure talent, keen to justify his newly elevated position and place his personal stamp upon the marque. And while it is contractually impossible to discuss BMW design without mentioning the infamous disruptor from Ohio, one could, if one concentrated really hard, see some parallels between both characters. However, on current form, I’m less than convinced that Mr. Dukec will become as much of a household name as one Christopher Edward Bangle – for better or worse.

Meanwhile we are witnessing the completion of a process which has seen BMW becoming untethered from a half century of design heritage, just as it has done with its previously inviolate engineering orthodoxies. In some ways this can be viewed as brave, since so much of the brand’s visual identity has been rooted in a number of seemingly sacrosanct stylistic flourishes, now discarded. But the risk is that without them, what does the BMW customer gravitate to in a world where brand (or at least established car brands like BMW) are losing their relevance?
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  #29  
Old 06-06-2020, 07:40 PM
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Lines all over the place, looks like it's endured at least 2 hefty facelifts by different teams before launch.
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  #30  
Old 06-07-2020, 07:17 AM
paranoidgarliclover paranoidgarliclover is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madskillz View Post
When Bangle's E92 came out it also differed significantly from the predecessors and was criticized heavily.
I don't recall that at all. What I do recall is auto mags saying that it was the least "Bangle'd" of all the designs, and this the conservative approach made sense b/c it was BMWs cash cow and thus the one the company was the least willing to subject to a controversial re-design.

My own opinion is that the E36 coupe was the best looking 3-series....

Last edited by paranoidgarliclover; 06-07-2020 at 07:21 AM.
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