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Nuvolari
03-01-2005, 06:06 AM
<A HREF="http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/d/77599" TARGET="_blank">http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/d/77599</A> <p><IMG SRC="http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/sixcms/media.php/20/porsche_355.81660.jpg" BORDER="0"><p>The article is in German and it says:<p><B>Porsche Panamera: The fourth line</B><br>Porsche is to bring out a four-door GT with V8 and V10-Motor in 2009 under the model name Panamera . <br>The concept will be presented by autumn at the IAA to the public.<br>After Cayman for the Boxster Coup (debut on the IAA in the autumn) now Panamera for the fourth Porsche line.<br>The Stuttgart sportscar manufacturers protected both names on the same day (15.1.2004) at the German patent office.<br>At the latest by autumn this year Porsche wants to present its concept for the fourth line.<br>The most important first in brief:<br>It's a four-door and four-seated front engine car with rear- and all-wheel drive, V8 and V10-engines with a range from 340 to over 600 PS.<br>The prices are to be settled between 100.000 and 150.000 .<br>Annually 20,000 units are focused.<br>The assembly in Leipzig is to begin 2009.<br><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by Nuvolari at 2:26 PM 3/1/2005</i>

Reppu
03-01-2005, 07:07 AM
Wonderful chop, it would be very small inside though if it turns to be like that. Anyway, four door saloon doesn't have to mean 'large sedan'. It might well be around 4,5m and that would be fine with me.

bucket
03-01-2005, 08:42 AM
where is porsche going with this? is it going to be a sportier alternative to the quattroporte, CLS, and (to a lesser extent) SWB S-class and SWB 7er?<p>or will they go for overbloated luxo-barge and make an arnage/maybach/phantom type of car?

Santeno
03-01-2005, 10:44 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bucket</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">where is porsche going with this? is it going to be a sportier alternative to the quattroporte, CLS, and (to a lesser extent) SWB S-class and SWB 7er?<p>or will they go for overbloated luxo-barge and make an arnage/maybach/phantom type of car?</TD></TR></TABLE><br>You were right in thinking cls/quatroporte, but probably not as big and a lot sportier. Probably something more along the lines of an rx-8 (but with proper rear seats), instead of a sportsedan, a sports car with 4 doors.

Kakairo
03-01-2005, 11:38 AM
Let's see if they actually build it this time.

Tidal
03-01-2005, 12:02 PM
I say bring it on Porsche. As long as they get the styling right, this should be an amazing car. Imo it should be about the same lenght as a Cayenne, 5-series, E-klass...<p>So the V8 should be from the Cayenne, would the V10 be from the Carrera GT? Is that feasible?

r3vilo
03-01-2005, 01:07 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>auto motor</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Detailed Panamera-story in car motor and sport notebooks 6 as of Wednesday harvests you all background information over the Porsche Panamera and possible cooperation partners in this project in notebooks 6 of car motor and sport that will be as of Wednesday (2.3.) in the trade. <p>Further focal point-subjects of this edition:<p> Up-to-date: the novelty of the Genevan car drawing-room. <br> Load report of new VW Passat.  Kleinwagen-Vergleichstest: Daihatsu Sirion, Renault Modus, Suzuki Ignis.  Large summer tire-test: ten of products of the dimension 225/45 R 17 in the comparison.  Load report 7er-BMW with Facelift and stronger motors.  Test VW Touareg W12.  Most doubly: Porsche Boxster against BMW Z4.  Load report of ranks Rover with Facelift and stronger motors.  Extra-part: navigation and car telephone.  The images of the automobile manufacturers under the magnifying glass.  History: the car-Kreationen of Pininfarina.  Before the start: large formula 1-analysis plus season-Guide as a Booklet for taking out. Daily know runs gives what heres all around car, motor and sport to the free-newsletters. <p></TD></TR></TABLE> This is an online translation. so not completely accurate.........can any one else speak german????? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/1zhelp.gif" BORDER="0">

Charger
03-01-2005, 01:38 PM
This chop looks way better than some of the others ones Ive seen. I hope they do build this. I wonder what the price range would be.

Aidan
03-01-2005, 02:05 PM
Pretty cool..i reckon it would be £70,000-90000..i think. Will porsche actually build it though

Seller Automotive
03-01-2005, 02:34 PM
This will be AWESOME.... V10, AWD!! kick ass.<p>I hope Lamborghini is paying attention.. this would be a very cool move for them as well. Take the segment even more upmarket with a base V10 and super V12 version. Porsche should have done this before the Cayenne.. And I hope Lamborghini builds something like this instead of an SUV.

Seller Automotive
03-01-2005, 03:06 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>DVieira</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I say bring it on Porsche. As long as they get the styling right, this should be an amazing car. Imo it should be about the same lenght as a Cayenne, 5-series, E-klass...<p>So the V8 should be from the Cayenne, would the V10 be from the Carrera GT? Is that feasible?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I think its wayyy tooo early to think about where the engine's will come from.. Remember, porsche wants to ditch the "ass engine/layout" for the 998 911, and make it a mid-engine... they have also said they need to ditch the boxer engine at some point... after 4.0liters in the boxer6, the internal mass starts drawing power rather than creating power.<p>ZERO reason to invest in a Boxer8 engine.. the product application is SOO limited.. I think there are a lot of speculation articles of Porsche wanting to use a V8 in the 998 911.. I guess it could be from the Cayenne... I would think they'd want to go back and design a true Sport V8, and save weight with design and materials.. <br>

Redline
03-01-2005, 04:35 PM
Why do I not see this happening. Porsche was simply tapping into an important market with the Cayenne, but I don't think we'll see a four-door Porsche car until we see a four-door Lamborghini or Ferrari car mass produced.

DoMiNo
03-01-2005, 06:57 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>GRANTURISMO</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Porsche often changes names sometimes.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Often sometimes, eh? <p>In any event, as someone said before, this is the best interpretation I've seen, so far, of a possible Porsche sedan. I'm thinking CLS55 AMG competitor? Think I'd still rather have the Benz...

DoMiNo
03-01-2005, 06:58 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Redline</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why do I not see this happening. Porsche was simply tapping into an important market with the Cayenne, but I don't think we'll see a four-door Porsche car until we see a four-door Lamborghini or Ferrari car mass produced.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Which will, of course, mean that <I>the end is near</I>.

jlaidler
03-01-2005, 07:09 PM
Didn't I just read in AW that VW wanted to bring out an MB CLS competitor. Made me think perhaps they would cook something up with Porsche again. Maybe so. Can't see Porsche developing a new platform for this without help.

Top Secret
03-02-2005, 12:15 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Seller Automotive</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> Remember, porsche wants to ditch the "ass engine/layout" for the 998 911, and make it a mid-engine... they have also said they need to ditch the boxer engine at some point... after 4.0liters in the boxer6, the internal mass starts drawing power rather than creating power.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>...if this is true, Porsche will be creating a monster (not the good kind) with the 998. It will be a sad day when Porsche forgoes the rear-engine layout with the classic boxer 6.<p>And I doubt Lamborghini or Ferrari will do this kind of car - they do not need it. Although a Lamborghini Espada will be mighty tasty.

Reppu
03-02-2005, 12:18 AM
I think a CLS competitor from Porsche makes A LOT of sense. Despite their good sales, it's getting harder and harder for Porsche to keep being independent, and growing in range and sales numbers is the only way forward for them.

Hornbag
03-02-2005, 12:39 AM
I just love dat picture, it looks so danm good, the red and those curves make it look nice.

Top Secret
03-02-2005, 12:46 AM
Hopefully it will be more of a Quattroporte competitor more than a CLS competitor.<p>And as someone said, it's actually quite coincidental that VW announces it will make a CLS competitor and then a few weeks later Porsche is considering a Panamera. But hopefully they won't base it off a VW - something about VW and Porsche being bed-buddies really bugs me.

Nuvolari
03-02-2005, 03:16 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>revilo_</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> This is an online translation. so not completely accurate.........can any one else speak german????? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/1zhelp.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>This is just a summary of the new issue of "auto motor und sport" available today. It will feature a detailed story of the Panamera.<p>BTW: I think it's official that the fourth Porsche will be called 'Panamera'...<p>

mzoltarp
03-02-2005, 06:05 AM
I would wonder if they might really call it the Panamericana after the race, but even that is a dopey name. I know everyone does the oohs and ahs over any derivative of 911 styling, but enough is enough. Porsche needs to create something truly new and captivating and not just endless permutations of the 911 shape.

r3vilo
03-02-2005, 06:10 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Nuvolari</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">BTW: I think it's official that the fourth Porsche will be called 'Panamera'...</TD></TR></TABLE><p><br>fourth porsche??????????:boxster, 911, cayenne, carrera gt and at some point in the near future, the panarama or whatever it will be called........that's five porsches

Reppu
03-02-2005, 07:23 AM
Carrera GT doesn't count i guess. In 1989 there was a Porsche prototype called 'Panamericana'....Panamera is fine with me, the other one is too long.<p>And also, i would suggest a member of CSS called Pandorama to quickly go and copyright his nick <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beigesmilewinkgrin.gif" BORDER="0">

phi
03-02-2005, 01:26 PM
the text tells something about a cooperation with the panamera - so i'll expect a vw/audi engine in this car, that will be slightly modified, like in the cayenne/tuareg.<br>so possibly the v10 from the gallardo would fit in this car.

sc43018
03-02-2005, 02:14 PM
This just seems too big of a jump of porsche (yes i know, the cayenne was huge as well) but why is porsche going 4-door before they hit a true 4-passenger coupe? Cl-class/6er type? A bigger, V10 911? That seems so much more reasonable, draw more appeal to Porsche without truly straying from roots..... am I the only one who thinks this sounds better?

Superfresa
03-02-2005, 03:33 PM
Cool chop but definitely not the correct size. Good to have more Porsches though, and I doubt that's the real name.

Nuvolari
03-02-2005, 04:22 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>phi</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the text tells something about a cooperation with the panamera - so i'll expect a vw/audi engine in this car, that will be slightly modified, like in the cayenne/tuareg.<br>so possibly the v10 from the gallardo would fit in this car.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I read the article in the new issue and it says:<p>Porsche is seeking for a cooperation partner to develop the new Panamera. One possible partner could be Volkswagen. Inside the group Bentley could use the new platform for its new Arnage, due in 2010. <br>But Volkswagen is just one of the negotiants. The other is still secret but rumors say that it could be... Toyota (!!) because Porsche is negotiating with Toyota about their hybrid-technology for the Cayenne.<br>But as Porsche chief Wiedeking says: "We have the resources that permit us to finance really everything which we plan for the future". So if no partner could be found, they'll do it on their own.<br>Something about the engines:<br>The Cayenne delivers its 4.5 V8 engines (340PS and 450PS) for the Panamera. The top-of-the-line engine comes from the Carrera GT: 5.7 V10 with 612PS.<p>So you see: No VW or Audi or Lamborghini engines in this Porsche!<br>BTW: The length of the Panamera could be about 4,90m.

Reppu
03-03-2005, 12:15 AM
4,90m...that's bad news. Handling will suffer because size means weight and lack of agility.

Hornbag
03-03-2005, 12:19 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Reppu</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">4,90m...that's bad news. Handling will suffer because size means weight and lack of agility.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Lets just hope they use lots of aluminum! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> We dont want another 2+ tone Porsche. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/1orglaugh.gif" BORDER="0">

Top Secret
03-03-2005, 01:47 AM
It will most probably be teamed up with VW, as they recently announced that they themselves would make a CLS-competitor. A bit of a shame really.

geary
03-03-2005, 03:48 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It will most probably be teamed up with VW, as they recently announced that they themselves would make a CLS-competitor. A bit of a shame really.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Just like the Tourag, the VW will clean the Porsche version up! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0">

Tidal
03-03-2005, 11:04 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It will most probably be teamed up with VW, as they recently announced that they themselves would make a CLS-competitor. A bit of a shame really.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I remember a couple of months ago someone at Porsche ( think it was their CEO ) saying that if they did give the green light to this car, they would lose a lot of friends... so maybe their going at it alone.<br>

Santeno
03-03-2005, 11:09 AM
Does anyone else think that the "Panamera" name just sounds incomplete and very un-porsche. It almost sounds like some of the made up sounds that many asian companies love to use. I mean was it so hard to call it "Panamericana" or better yet "Panamerica"? both real words and easily recogniseable as having a real life conection to porsche's history?

Superfresa
03-05-2005, 02:41 PM
Panamericana is the largest paper store here and so it sounds cheap. It's also the name of the highway going from Argentina to Colombia ( I think even up to Canada but not sure). <p>Panamerica would be OK though, very race style name.

Santeno
03-05-2005, 02:57 PM
fresa, panamericana is named after a race that was held on the highway you are referring to. and that highway runs from tierra del fuego to alaska (with a slight interruption between Panama'as and Colombia's Darien and Chocoe provinces).

ToronadoGT
03-05-2005, 04:32 PM
Cool. This looks pretty good. I have an old Car & Driver from 1992 or 1993, I beleve, that has photos of the first Porsche sedan.<p>I feel that Porsche will go head with the project. And it'll probably sell well to boot. And what's the code name, anyway? 990? (The codename for the first sedan was 989, I think.)

Pedigreepaul
03-07-2005, 12:54 PM
I think you're refering to these pics..a canceled project by Porsche.. A four-door 911 called 989<p><A HREF="http://www.flat-6.net/forum/f6_attachment.php?&attachmentid=4264&twidth=1024" TARGET="_blank">http://www.flat-6.net/forum/f6...=1024</A><p>source: Flat-6.net

LSS_C6
03-11-2005, 10:11 AM
Launching a sedan it`s a risky strategy! Let`s see how is it going to be...Porsche comited some mistakes in the past.<br>Panamera is a name that i dislike!

Nuvolari
03-14-2005, 03:44 AM
Here's chop from the rear of the Panamera:<p><IMG SRC="http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/sixcms/media.php/23/porsche2_450.81669.jpg" BORDER="0"><p>Source: <A HREF="http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de" TARGET="_blank">http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de</A>

r3vilo
03-14-2005, 04:55 AM
that chop of the rear to me is very disappointing.....it just looks like someone trying to cram in another door onto the 911.....

Tman2
03-15-2005, 07:28 PM
<A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com</A> has a blurb on the New Panamera. Looks... well... looks like a 911. Of course, this is just my opinion.<p><A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=101990" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=101990</A>

Roadster44
03-15-2005, 09:06 PM
Okay so get your orders in now if you want a 4 seater Porsche. Are there any prototypes running around? Does anybody know when the project started? When was it approved? That's one thing I want to learn about automotive business is how long it takes from origination of product to its unveiling. I heard 8 years for current bmw 7 series for example.

sc43018
03-16-2005, 04:51 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Roadster44</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Okay so get your orders in now if you want a 4 seater Porsche. Are there any prototypes running around? Does anybody know when the project started? When was it approved? That's one thing I want to learn about automotive business is how long it takes from origination of product to its unveiling. I heard 8 years for current bmw 7 series for example.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I can't imagine that it takes that long for any other car, the 7-series is a flagship, technologically advanced car.... 8 years makes sense, but i doubt most other cars take over 5

Grande Espace
03-18-2005, 08:44 AM
They said it was too expensive to make

Redline
03-18-2005, 05:20 PM
You must mean four door, because the 911 has had four seats for a long time now.

mzoltarp
03-19-2005, 06:21 AM
8 years is a bit long. My guess is that the reason a car like the BMW 7 series is around for 8 years in the marketplace is entirely a profit-driven decision. At some point the tooling is paid off and the profits rise. With respect to the Panamera, VW/Porsche have their respective engines proven. Would not surprise me if they cheated and resurrected the 928's rear suspension which was known for some pretty tenacious handling. Suspension could be also cribbed from Audi. Heck they could do an Audi A6 chassis and send the power to the rear wheels easily. This vehicle is most likely already a cut and paste mule running around undetected. You may not know that the 928 mules were running under Audi 100 bodies which fueled speculation that Audi was going to advance up market when all along the high speed Audis were 928s in drag.

Roadster44
03-19-2005, 08:57 PM
Panamera must be perfectly executed and then some more to be a a successful car.

skoochythatone
03-20-2005, 02:57 PM
Guys, be sure that Porsche does plan this well enough. Porsche is among the most profitable car companies world wide, they will make sure that a 4th model is well developed, well manufactured and will be another perfect Porsche product. Porsche has been making cars for a very long time and they know how to make good cars. Amen.

mzoltarp
03-20-2005, 05:26 PM
The convertible top and oil leak recalls on the Boxster notwithstanding.

skoochythatone
03-21-2005, 05:14 AM
Ok..lets start to compare recalls...how many did NorthAmerican brands have in the last 5 yrs? Now compare that to Porsches numbers and you know what quality is. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bangin.gif" BORDER="0">

spwolf
03-21-2005, 06:13 AM
lets not get into silly arguments now!<p>---<p>This is the car that Porsche always needed.. cant wait to see the specs!

mzoltarp
03-21-2005, 06:14 AM
Agreed Spywolf!!

skoochythatone
03-21-2005, 06:41 AM
Agree with you guys, never meant to start an argument about quality issues..still wouldve won it ;-)<p>I also cant wait for this new model, it looks very promising and sexy.

knicks125
03-21-2005, 06:47 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>skoochythatone</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Ok..lets start to compare recalls...how many did NorthAmerican brands have in the last 5 yrs? Now compare that to Porsches numbers and you know what quality is. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bangin.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>it's not a silly argument...but it's a stupid comparison as posed by skoochythatone, you can't compare porsche with NA brands, you don't compare apple to orange (luxury vs. mainstream)<p>also domestic brands (us) and european brands, over the last few years, have not fared well in the quality department. While us brands continue to improve, european brands continue to slump, recalls from both are often and regular <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0">

skoochythatone
03-21-2005, 07:33 AM
I agree Knicks and I dont wanna get in an argument with you guys, my personal opinion is that European cars are one level above US models quality and design wise anyway, but that might just be. Whenever I am in the US and drive a rental car or friends cars, I feel like uncomfortable when I look at the dashboard, the interior and the quality on the inside...but then again..might just be ME...or am I not the only one? ;-)

ultima1
03-21-2005, 01:24 PM
This Porsche doesn't look half bad, in fact, it looks great.

knicks125
03-21-2005, 01:56 PM
Four-Door Porsche Sedan Set for Frankfurt Debut<br>Date Posted 03-18-2005 <p>STUTTGART, Germany  Porsche will unveil a fifth model line, a luxury four-door coupe called the Panamera, at the Frankfurt auto show in September.<p>Looking like a stretched 911, the Panamera will become Porsche's flagship, and will go head-to-head with the Mercedes-Benz CLS and the Maserati Quattroporte.<p>The Panamera will go into production in 2008. It will be powered by the same 4.5-liter V8 engines found in the Cayenne SUV, in both 340-horsepower naturally aspirated form and 450-hp turbocharged form. And like the Cayenne, which shares running gear with the Volkswagen Touareg, the car could be built on a platform shared with VW.<p>Volkswagen recently announced the end of collaboration talks with Maserati, and could be prepared to talk to Porsche again. VW could use the Panamera platform to build a new Bentley to replace the Arnage, or to build a new luxury VW to replace the slow-selling Phaeton. This would mean the Panamera is likely to be a front-engine, rear-drive car  a layout abandoned by Porsche in the 1990s when it withdrew the 928 and 944 models.<p>What this means to you: Porsche is hoping its Midas touch will extend to a luxury sedan/coupe. We're hoping to have gotten that huge promotion and subsequent pay raise by 2008.<p>Edmunds Insideline

skoochythatone
03-21-2005, 03:13 PM
The car presented in Frankfurt will just be a concept by the way..dont misunderstand that article.

mzoltarp
03-22-2005, 06:19 AM
Skoochythatone,<br>German premium cars are generally of higher quality than American mainstream, but VW (mainstream) has had more than a few problems and Mercedes has has a woeful time with electronics (nothing severe just annoying). A Mercedes will still last forever, so you are correct to point out the relative quality levels, but the reality is that a car like a Toyota Corolla which is made in the USA and a total entry level car is nearly flawless in execution with astounding quality. In my considered opinion, the Japanese still lead the pack and it does not seem to matter if the Japanese car is made here or in Japan. I'm a total German car fanatic, but aside from a Rabbit GTi, my driveway is Asian at the moment.

bolita
03-22-2005, 11:21 AM
Going back to time from design to production .... just look at what Toyota did with the Prius.<p>less than 18 months for an entirely new type of vehicle (Hybrid). I really don't think anyone can do it better than this example of Toyota, but I am certain that Porsche can have the Panamera ready within the next few years... 2008 seems to far away for me...

the future
05-27-2005, 02:50 AM
According to "auto, motor und sport", the Porsche Panamera will be a vehicle similar to the Mercedes-Benz R-class. Porsche chairman Wiedeking says that it will resemble a "true family Porsche", whatever this means. The Panamera will be so lang that there is enough space for a third row of seats, and so tall that it has almost the dimensions of the SUV Cayenne. Probably, the fourth Porsche will already come into the market in 2008.<p>If you ask me, Porsche should better build a big GT sportscar with a V8 or V10, as a kind of successor of the 928. If you look at the model range of Ferrari, Lamborghini and Aston Martin, Porsche is really lacking a model to compete with Maranello, Murcielago and Vanquish. They make enough money with their Cayennes and Boxsters, so that they should really spend their profit either for a sports engagement or a real prestige sports car.

Reppu
05-27-2005, 03:59 AM
I totally agree. An R-class-like is not what people expects from Porsche. A true sports and powerful V10 GT.......FINE!!. A four door V10 luxury sedan.....quite fine. But a people mover......no way.

DSC-OFF
06-28-2005, 08:47 AM
<IMG SRC="http://www.iafrica.com/cm_pics/motor/18-3207-0-0_187218.jpg" BORDER="0"><p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>iafrica.com</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><u>Porsche is soon to reveal details of its fifth model line </u>  a coupe-like sedan  according to our sources. <p>Of course, we exclusively previewed it in the June 2004 issue of Cars in Action. The car, to be called Panamera, will be revealed in concept form at the Frankfurt Motor Show in Germany later this year. <p>When the production version hits the streets, likely in the latter half of next year, it will go head to head with cars like the Mercedes-Benz CLS55 AMG and BMW M5. We expect that the car will have a four-door layout with suicide rear doors, much like the Mazda RX-8 in concept. <p>It is likely that the Panamera will use the same 250kW and 280kW 4.5-litre V8 engines found in the Cayenne and Cayenne S, with the mighty 455kW V10 sourced from the Carrera GT topping the range. <p>We expect its rear-wheel drive platform will be shared with a forthcoming Volkswagen luxury sedan, in cooperation similar to the one that gave birth to the Porsche Cayenne and VW Touareg. </TD></TR></TABLE><p><A HREF="http://motoring.iafrica.com/exclusives/426038.htm" TARGET="_blank">Motoring.iAfrica</A>

mattthebad
06-28-2005, 12:38 PM
"When the production version hits the streets, likely in the latter half of next year,"<p>That sound BS to me. Porsche decides in june/july whether the 5th modell will be built and what it will be like. There stands absolutely no chance Porsche will get this car on the road before late 2007 early 2008.<p>It was expected Porsche'd team up with either VW or Audi to built this car on a shared platform. No alliance yet, no car in development!<p>Am I wrong? Please let me know.

odic
06-28-2005, 12:43 PM
nooooo, we're always gonna see a porsche every corner <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/crying.gif" BORDER="0"><br>too much for me, even more<br>srry guys, but i really hate their let's-do-the-mercedes-bmw-and-audi-thing.<p>Many thanks to Porsche for making their cars non-exclusive. <br>

Santeno
06-28-2005, 01:05 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mattthebad</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">"When the production version hits the streets, likely in the latter half of next year," That sound BS to me. </TD></TR></TABLE><br>I would take this entire report with a large can of salt. when was the last time you heard of this publication or it's implieded exclusives?

skoochythatone
07-04-2005, 01:07 PM
There is a very good article on spiegel.de in the car section about this possible 4th Porsche model. It says that it will take styling clues from the last generation(996) 911 and will be a 4door vehicle powered by both the V8 from the Cayenne and also by the V10 from the Carrera GT. Drawings of the final design have already been shown to customers around the world and on July 27th the decision will be made if it will make it into production.<br>For you Germans out there(sorry..its too much to translate):<br><A HREF="http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/0,1518,363390,00.html" TARGET="_blank">http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/....html</A>

copic
07-04-2005, 01:25 PM
it's almost impossible that it'll take design clues from the 996 ... that design style would be far to old. They just say 911 ... and it would be typical for non-car-magazines writing about cars to print to old pics <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0">

AM2K
07-21-2005, 03:09 PM
Just to go along with the info that 7 speed amg provided, i found this info from the 4car site:<p><B>The body of the four-door Porsche Panamera will be made in Austria by Magna Steyr, according to German magazine Der Spiegel. The bodyshells will then be transported to Leipzig, Germany, where the Panamera will be assembled alongside the Porsche Cayenne, with which it will share much of its powertrain. The Panamera will come with the same 4.5-litre V8 as the Cayenne, offered in turbo and normally-aspirated forms, and, in the range-topping model, a detuned version of the Carrera GT's 5.7 V10. <p>The Panamera is said to be a four-door fastback coupe in the vein of the Mercedes-Benz CLS; it will be front-engined, with its platform co-developed with Volkswagen, which will use this as the basis of its long-awaited C1, VW's BMW 5-Series rival. The platform - engineered for rear-wheel drive and four-wheel drive - is also expected to underpin the Mk2 Phaeton range, a luxury crossover to take on Mercedes' R-Class, and perhaps even a 'baby' Bentley to fit in the range below the Flying Spur. <p>Porsche is expected to unveil a Panamera concept car at the Frankfurt Motor Show this coming September, though production will not start until 2007 or even 2008.</B><p>SOURCE: 4CAR

Charger
07-25-2005, 07:58 AM
Panamera wagon?<br><A HREF="https://www.autokampioen.nl/published/akm/content/afbeeldingen/toekomst/porsst12007t050715g-139939_enlarged_139966.jpg" TARGET="_blank">https://www.autokampioen.nl/pu...6.jpg</A><br><A HREF="https://www.autokampioen.nl/published/akm/content/afbeeldingen/toekomst/porsst22007t050715g-139947_enlarged_139984.jpg" TARGET="_blank">https://www.autokampioen.nl/pu...4.jpg</A><br> <br> <br> <br>

against the wall
07-25-2005, 08:19 AM
i remember reading an article a while ago about the panamera being like the family man's porsche and it would be more of a wagon than a sedan.<br>anyways, when was the last time porsche made a front engine car?

tagomago
07-25-2005, 09:54 AM
I may be a purist, although I think Porsche is really moving away from it's heritage. Of course the Cayenne pretty much did that in one fell swoop. Many purists felt that way when the first front engine, watercooled Porsche hit the streets in the form of the 924.

against the wall
07-25-2005, 11:03 AM
o yea i forgot about the cayenne. forget about my front engine comment.

against the wall
07-27-2005, 09:37 AM
<A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102871" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102871</A><p>cant really tell but kinda looks like some of the renderings.<br>in the article autoweek says that this will be the fourth model line. does the cayman not count as seperate model line and is considered part of the boxster line?<BR><BR>
<i>Modified by bonzo's montreaux at 9:52 AM 7/27/2005</i>

tagomago
07-27-2005, 09:57 AM
Yeah, I'd like to forget about the Cayenne as well. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/all_coholic.gif" BORDER="0">

tagomago
07-27-2005, 10:02 AM
Wow, Porsche is finally copying Mazda. Do they really need to produce a car like this??? I could get the Mazda 3 wagon and save the money, although the rear end looks like the Volvo P1800. So when are they introducing their new mini-van?

DoMiNo
07-27-2005, 10:16 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>tagomago</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Wow, Porsche is finally copying Mazda. Do they really need to produce a car like this??? I could get the Mazda 3 wagon and save the money, although the rear end looks like the Volvo P1800. So when are they introducing their new mini-van? </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Uhm... just keep telling yourself you'd buy a Mazda3 if you had this kind of money. Wealth changes one's entire perspective on the practicality vs. exclusivity issue.

carmaniac
07-27-2005, 10:43 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Panamera a Go-Go: Porsche to build four-door sports car; vehicle to bow in '09<br>Posted Date: 7/27/05<br>As we reported several months ago (AW, March 21), Porsche's flirtation with a four-door sports car has become a reality.<p>The automaker today officially announced it has approved the development and production of the long-rumored fourth Porsche model line. The vehicle, called Panamera, will have four seats, four doors, rear drive and a choice of front-mounted engines.<p>Power for the new car is set to come from the same 4.5-liter V8 engines as those offered on the Cayenne. They include a naturally aspirated version with 340 hp and a turbo*charged unit with 450 hp. An even more powerful model with more than 500 hp is also in the pipeline. Scheduled to enter the market in 2009, the new car’s name is derived from the legendary Carrera Panamericana long-distance race.<p>Up to 20,000 examples of the Panamera are expected to roll annually from Porsche’s Leipzig factory in Germany, where it will be produced alongside the Cayenne. A concept version of the vehicle is expected to bow at the Frankfurt motor show in September.<p>"The Panamera is a perfect fit for Porsche,” said Dr. Wendelin Wiedeking, the President and CEO of Porsche AG. “It has all the typical DNA characteristic of a genuine sports car. In terms of performance, design, and driving dynamics, it meets Porsche's high standards in every respect. Through this sports coupe we are making our customers a highly attractive offer in the top performance segment."<p>Porsche will develop and build the Panamera using the company's own resources. "We will be developing a separate platform for our fourth model line at our Weissach R&D center,” said Wiedeking. “There are no plans for a joint venture with another car maker, but to ensure the profitability of this new model line we will cooperate more closely than so far with selected system suppliers."<p>Production of the Panamera in Leipzig could create as many as 600 new jobs. In the course of the project, approximately 400 more new jobs will be created at Porsche's original plant in Stuttgart-Zuffenhausen, where the engines for the fourth model line will be built, and at the Weissach Development Center.<p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Source: <A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102871" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=102871</A>

against the wall
07-27-2005, 10:43 AM
i just posted that

carmaniac
07-27-2005, 11:12 AM
whoops <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0">

tagomago
07-27-2005, 11:17 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>DoMiNo</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Uhm... just keep telling yourself you'd buy a Mazda3 if you had this kind of money. Wealth changes one's entire perspective on the practicality vs. exclusivity issue.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Well, maybe with that sort of money I would fold, although that is not the type of Porsche I would be likely to buy. Having owned a 1987 Porsche 944, these are not everyday cars (and I learned that quickly, as I had one as a daily driver) mainly for their cost of maintence and repairs. I guess I don't quite fathom having enough money to rationalize this sort of purchase. I guess I am getting more pragmatic with age, but the Mazda 3 wagon just makes more sense. Sorry, I can't believe I am saying this either.

Uberwagon
07-27-2005, 12:10 PM
Dare to dream big, tagomago. Porsches are very daily-driver-friendly if you have the money. Maintenance on these are expensive, for certain. But that is simply part of the price of entry. This Panamera, like other Porsches, will be in an entirely different league (or three) from the Mazda3. While the 3 is a fine car, I don't see any viable comparison between the two.<p>While the purists may lament this and the Cayenne, the reality of today's auto business dictates that Porsche build more volume or die. The sportscar segments don't offer enough sales to keep the company afloat anymore. Just as important, they don't offer STABLE sales either. The sportscar market is extremely volatile and cyclical, much like fashion. Hence, the Porsche SUV, which now accounts for around 45% of their sales, give or take, and a massive chunk of their revenue.<p>Change of this sort is difficult to reconcile with Porsche of old, but purely necessary.<br>

AM2K
07-27-2005, 04:23 PM
This is an official design sketch from Porsche that came with the Panamera press release:<p><IMG SRC="http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/9755/panacss0eu.jpg" BORDER="0"><p><br><A HREF="http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/9755/panacss0eu.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://img122.imageshack.us/im...u.jpg</A>

LEXUS FAN!
07-27-2005, 08:49 PM
i wasn't sure if that was official, but thanks...it looks identical to the chop, except no suicide doors

LEXUS FAN!
07-28-2005, 10:05 PM
i was hoping the price would be cheaper...like CLS type pricing, but oh well<p>$125,000 to $175,000 is a lot of money

Santeno
07-29-2005, 07:28 AM
One of these days, Porsche is going to have to start experimenting with shapes not related to the 911. They've done it in the past. a few designs were less than pleasing (can we say 914 and 924) but others were (and still are) wonderful - latter gen 944's and the still stunning 928. Sadly even when those cars started to flounder, porsche resorted to grafting headlights on them reminicent of the 911. They are a wonderful engineering company, but they really need to start exploring their inner designer.

toby2449
07-29-2005, 07:46 AM
<br>yeah i fully agree, Porsche really need to design something original, not everything should be a 911 rip off, do their designers not have any talent?

Uberwagon
07-29-2005, 10:53 AM
Same here. I like that they incorporate their design heritage into everything but I think they're finding the limits of that. It would be nice to see them broaden the pallete and stretch the designs a bit.

Krypton
07-29-2005, 04:32 PM
I was rereading their brochure and they seemed to emphasize how the center of their company is how they improve instead of changing the vehicles and how changi is easier than improving

synthesis
07-29-2005, 05:56 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Santeno</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">One of these days, Porsche is going to have to start experimenting with shapes not related to the 911. They've done it in the past. a few designs were less than pleasing (can we say 914 and 924) but others were (and still are) wonderful - latter gen 944's and the still stunning 928. Sadly even when those cars started to flounder, porsche resorted to grafting headlights on them reminicent of the 911. They are a wonderful engineering company, but they really need to start exploring their inner designer.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>two words: carrera gt<p>yes i know it's not a volume car, but it is still a different shape. it is a car with its own unique look while still instantly being known as a porsche. different stance, graphics, detailing compared to the 911. has some curves that resemble the 911, but hey that's the porsche look; not just the 911 look. they are still a relatively small company, so i feel its a benefit (not a detriment) that their cars resemble eachother. when you begin to get a larger line of vehicles, oftentimes you lose sight of your original designs and then the company, and the rest of the world, wonders what happened to the core design language. i say good job to porsche, for making sure their vehicles will instantly be known as such. <p>btw santeno can you please check my post under "feedback and suggestions" when you get a chance

DoMiNo
07-29-2005, 08:18 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Santeno</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">One of these days, Porsche is going to have to start experimenting with shapes not related to the 911. They've done it in the past. a few designs were less than pleasing (can we say 914 and 924) but others were (and still are) wonderful - latter gen 944's and the still stunning 928. Sadly even when those cars started to flounder, porsche resorted to grafting headlights on them reminicent of the 911. They are a wonderful engineering company, but they really need to start exploring their inner designer.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>God I love 928s. Tried like hell to get my dad to buy a cherry '84 928S one time... he got scared by some maintenance horror stories, though. Why can't Porsche do something more along those lines... a large GT, rather than a 4-door? Is a sedan really more desirable?

mzoltarp
07-30-2005, 06:54 AM
Porsche's fate, ultimately, will be to be gobbled up by a larger company. With Lexus, Acura, and Infiniti all preparing supercars, the days of buying a new Porsche that looks like a derivative of a 1965 911 are probably numbered. They need a car that people say "Wow, I would have never believed it was a Porsche!"

oversteer
07-30-2005, 09:55 AM
I think that as long as the relationship with VW works, they will continue to develop with them. Saving money on the developing cost means more opportunities like the Cayenne and this new project. <br>Cayenne really open there eyes to more democratic, ans so, lucrative cars. IMO.<br>As for this new project, maybe there they whant to put a Porsche passenger car next to the Boxter in people's garages. Keep it in the familly.

DoMiNo
07-30-2005, 05:40 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mzoltarp</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Porsche's fate, ultimately, will be to be gobbled up by a larger company. With Lexus, Acura, and Infiniti all preparing supercars, the days of buying a new Porsche that looks like a derivative of a 1965 911 are probably numbered. They need a car that people say "Wow, I would have never believed it was a Porsche!"</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I myself was slightly puzzled as to why Porsche backtracked, design-wise, on the new 911, to make it more recognizeable as the classic Porsche shape. Perhaps they had a good reason and, thus, feel there's still life left in the 911 as the quintessential Porsche, which will never go out of style. I'm not saying I personally think they're correct or incorrect, just a thought.

Uberwagon
07-30-2005, 07:39 PM
From the looks of it and press opinion, the idea behind the 997 was a return to the styling of the 993. That version of the 911 regularly sells well above the going rate on newer 996's in the second-hand market and seems to be the most successful & popular of the late designs. <p>I think a good point was made about Porsche keeping its designs more integrated given the low volume and small company nature of their business. They DO have a very strong design language. Makes sense. But I too loved the 928 and would love to see some kind of similar evolution or stretching of that core. <p>Regardless, I think this news sedoup (or coupan?) will not be a boulevard cruiser like Mercedes' new CLS. IMHO, this will probably be a legitimate GT, much like that of the 928 albeit with a bit more practicality making it easier to rationalize to the wife (excuse the sexism). That's Porsche's way.

Roadster44
07-31-2005, 10:50 AM
5 pages long and not a single spy shot. I think it be a fair statement to make in saying that it'll be quite a while before we'll see any pics...excluding the supposed preview in September in Frankfurt.

iamalittlepepper
08-01-2005, 02:29 AM
The reliability are atrocious.. I think these days the cars are junked rather than fixed.. I mean a new "refurb" tranny probably cost more than a lot of the 928es out there<p>Then again it seems anytime Porsche goes for any part sharing with VAG.. things like gearboxes and most often gearboxes are the main problem.<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>DoMiNo</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">God I love 928s. Tried like hell to get my dad to buy a cherry '84 928S one time... he got scared by some maintenance horror stories, though. Why can't Porsche do something more along those lines... a large GT, rather than a 4-door? Is a sedan really more desirable? </TD></TR></TABLE>

mzoltarp
08-01-2005, 07:00 AM
If you own a 928 and want to keep it running at a reasonable cost, buying several parts cars is essential. The 928 is a stout piece, but parts are wildly expensive and nearly impossible to find. Same is true for the 944 but because more 944s were built, parts are easier to find. The main problems with the 928 centered around engine cooling. Keeping the radiator clean, the water pump working, and the engine fan operational was key to keeping a 928 alive. Do that and it will last forever. Treat it like a Camry and it's dead in the water.

the future
08-05-2005, 12:46 AM
<A HREF="http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/sixcms/media.php/10/heft_150.100620.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.auto-motor-und-spor...0.jpg</A> <p><A HREF="http://media.autobild.de/bild/1/22896e30b0adb9a1ba0b1d0b9ce0a471_1.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://media.autobild.de/bild/...1.jpg</A><p>These magazine covers are a few days old, I wonder that nobody hasn't posted them yet. I don't know if these are official pictures. On one hand, both magazines have these pictures at the same time, on the other hand, if they are real, why aren't they elsewhere in the internet?<BR><BR>
<i>Modified by freeezer at 12:51 AM 8/5/2005</i>

SELLER
08-05-2005, 08:18 AM
The headlights in that 2nd pic certainly follow the look of the updated Cayenne's lights.. which would be a VERY COOL direction for porsche to start heading..<p>I nice aggressive headlight design. something like that is the only way I see the 998 911 being extremely popular.. they gotta do all new styling, and they gotta do it perfectly. There is too much competition coming out VERY soon, Porsche is going to start losing a LOT of 911 sales if they cant come to the table with an extremely Fresh/Popular 998 911.

Top Secret
08-05-2005, 08:32 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>SELLER</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I nice aggressive headlight design. something like that is the only way I see the 998 911 being extremely popular.. they gotta do all new styling, and they gotta do it perfectly. There is too much competition coming out VERY soon, Porsche is going to start losing a LOT of 911 sales if they cant come to the table with an extremely Fresh/Popular 998 911.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I disagree. The fact is, the 911 does not need a revolutionary, all-new styling. It's an icon which does not need any drastic changes for it to succeed. The past 40-odd years of the 911's life proves it. Just look at the original version of 1964 and compare it to the picture of the current 2005 model. Slightly changed, but the basic fundamental shape is very noticeable. That's what makes the 911 so popular - it has looked the same from generation to generation, so it appeals to every generation, from grandpa's to teenagers. The mainstay of it's design is a big part of he success of the 911. The styling is weaved into the 911's DNA - Porsche cannot afford to change a winning formula.<p>From my point of view, radically changing the design of the 911 will only LOSE more customers.

mzoltarp
08-05-2005, 12:10 PM
The issue is not whether the 911 should remain looking like a 911. The issue is why every other Porsche has to be a caricature of the 911.

SELLER
08-05-2005, 11:40 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>I disagree. The fact is, the 911 does not need a revolutionary, all-new styling. It's an icon which does not need any drastic changes for it to succeed. The past 40-odd years of the 911's life proves it. Just look at the original version of 1964 and compare it to the picture of the current 2005 model. Slightly changed, but the basic fundamental shape is very noticeable. That's what makes the 911 so popular - it has looked the same from generation to generation, so it appeals to every generation, from grandpa's to teenagers. The mainstay of it's design is a big part of he success of the 911. The styling is weaved into the 911's DNA - Porsche cannot afford to change a winning formula.<p>From my point of view, radically changing the design of the 911 will only LOSE more customers.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>That sure is a respected opinion / argument... but isnt it just a tad too 'easy' to make such a comment.<p>The real truth is the 911 has been so successful because it has never had adequite competition, the worlds eyes are about to be open to that truth.. and by 2010, there will be no less than 7 sports cars in the 70-130k range... cars from manufacturers that now understand what a large 'slice' porsche has been taking out of the 'sports car pie', in a price range generally left absent by most manufactuers. The future will define the 911, and whether or not Porsche has the foresight to take a risk, in order to stay ahead.

Charger
08-12-2005, 11:46 AM
<IMG SRC="http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/4735/988c637a331bfa8d391df1c512a6e9.jpg" BORDER="0"> <br> <IMG SRC="http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/8234/81401560441525e5cfe213fcbbb0da.jpg" BORDER="0"> <br>source: autobild

DSC-OFF
08-12-2005, 12:06 PM
For a mere $90,000 it too can be yours!

Omar
08-12-2005, 12:41 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">For a mere $90,000 it too can be yours!</TD></TR></TABLE><br>is that all? I'll order two then!!!

Charger
08-16-2005, 08:30 AM
Sorry, dont know if these are new<br><A HREF="http://automotorundsport.de/d/88895/d_ams_fotoshow_detail?skip=1" TARGET="_blank">http://automotorundsport.de/d/...kip=1</A><br><A HREF="http://automotorundsport.de/d/88895/d_ams_fotoshow_detail?skip=0" TARGET="_blank">http://automotorundsport.de/d/...kip=0</A>

against the wall
08-16-2005, 08:45 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Charger</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Sorry, dont know if these are new<br><A HREF="http://automotorundsport.de/d/88895/d_ams_fotoshow_detail?skip=1" TARGET="_blank">http://automotorundsport.de/d/...kip=1</A><br><A HREF="http://automotorundsport.de/d/88895/d_ams_fotoshow_detail?skip=0" TARGET="_blank">http://automotorundsport.de/d/...kip=0</A></TD></TR></TABLE><p>i dont know if that is it or the one u posted earlier on this page but this one is hot too! rear visibility must be terrible though.

SHEPO
08-17-2005, 05:42 PM
look at this (scroll all the way down past the audi Q7)<p><A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=103011" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com/news.cms?newsId=103011</A><p>and this<p><A HREF="http://forums.autoweek.com/thread.jspa?forumID=208&threadID=19387&tstart=0" TARGET="_blank">http://forums.autoweek.com/thr...art=0</A>

caarmike
08-17-2005, 06:16 PM
I was surprised last week when Autoweek said that no pictures had ever been released of the Porsche 989 beacuse I remembered seeing them in the early '90s in AutoWeek!<br>Anyway, I'm not a Porsche purist at all, I'm more of a sport sedan person. So when I saw the 989 and now the Panamera, they didn't strike me as sacrilege at all. In fact the 989 appealed to me more than any other Porsche I've seen. So anyone who wants to bash Porsche for breaking their own mold should remember that these new and different vehicles bring new people into the fold. Plus, just think, if Porsche had actually built the 989, the Mercedes CLS would be seen as a copycat.

Roadster44
08-17-2005, 09:46 PM
This is going to be one interesting and I suspect amazingly rewarding vehicle to drive. But in the end we have MB to thank for cracking open a new segment with the CLS...which itself was based on idea of older Jag XJ's...long, wide body and low roof. Thanks Jaguar!!!

bucket
10-09-2005, 02:43 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>mzoltarp</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Porsche's fate, ultimately, will be to be gobbled up by a larger company. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>if that happens, let's hope it's not VW. porsche would probably get the bentley treatment (which itself is not much different from what has happened to saab at the hands of GM). i can certainly think of <A HREF="http://www.ride-or-die.com/images/E500-1.jpg" TARGET="_blank">another</A> company with a decent track record of collaborations with porsche that would be a more fitting parent company.<p>

Top Secret
10-09-2005, 05:36 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>bucket</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">if that happens, let's hope it's not VW. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Can't be anyway. Porsche, effectively, 'owns' VW now.

Santeno
10-10-2005, 07:37 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Can't be anyway. Porsche, effectively, 'owns' VW now.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>EXCUSE ME???<br>If you are going to make wild claims, please be so kind as to back them up.

Avenue
10-10-2005, 09:32 AM
Old news..<p>Porsche has bought 20% of VW stocks to protect the company from foreign investors. The did this 1-2weeks ago.. According to German law, its now forbidden for foreign investors to buy VW because of Porsches stocks in VW.<p><A HREF="http://www.automotorsport.se/nyhetsmall.asp?version=24763" TARGET="_blank">http://www.automotorsport.se/n...24763</A><p>In english..<p><A HREF="http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=72101" TARGET="_blank">http://www.turkishpress.com/news.asp?id=72101</A><p><A HREF="http://www.businessweek.com/investor/content/sep2005/pi20050926_3958_pi080.htm" TARGET="_blank">http://www.businessweek.com/in...0.htm</A><p>Porsche was down 59.38 to 618.49. The market has been ruffled by the company's announced plan to buy a 20% stake in VW. The company, which already owns 5% of VW, is seeking to prevent a hostile takeover of the group. The two companies have significant agreements in parts supply and part share on the Touareg model. Porsche has 2.5 billion in cash and could possibly buy part of the group's treasury stock as well as 5% held by Merrill. On the broker front, DrKW hardly sees any business logic in this transaction. It notes that VW's return on consolidated equity is at only 5%, while the company's stands at around 26%. In addition, DrKW points out that the company will need over 1 billion cash for the development of its new Panamera sports wagon that is due to be launched in 2009, which will be a further drain on cash and raising the possibility of raising debt to finance this project. Deutsche downgrades Porsche's stock to sell from hold, lowering the target to 550 from 740. Despite initial negative reaction in the company's share price to the news, CSFB says the fundamental growth story remains intact, and reiterated its outperform rating on Porsche. <p>Meanwhile, VW was up 0.54 to 52.40. DrKW says Porsche's announced intention to buy a 20% stake in the company again raises the question whether there is a conflict of interest. It says switch into DaimlerChrysler as it keeps its hold rating on the company's stock. Another broker, Sal. Oppenheim, upgraded the company's stock to buy from reduce, lifting the fair value to 60.8 from 40.9.<p><br><i>Modified by Avenue at 9:37 AM 10/10/2005</i><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by Avenue at 9:39 AM 10/10/2005</i>

mattthebad
10-10-2005, 01:18 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Avenue</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Old news..<p>Porsche has bought 20% of VW stocks to protect the company from foreign investors. The did this 1-2weeks ago... <B>According to German law</B> , its now forbidden for foreign investors to buy VW because of Porsches stocks in VW.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>This is not correct. Of course anyone can still buy VW shares, but as VW, Porsche and Niedersachsen(German State)hold 51% of VW shares, no one'd be able to buy the majority of shares as long as no one of the above threes is willing to sell.

against the wall
01-06-2006, 02:07 PM
probably a chop but whatever<br><A HREF="http://www.germancarfans.com/spyphotos.cfm/spyphotoid/6060106.002/pageview/photo/photo/Mini5/page/1/porsche/1.html" TARGET="_blank">http://www.germancarfans.com/s....html</A>

ndjan
01-06-2006, 04:07 PM
Not diggin the bubble-hatch, but otherwise nice<br>

Ascariss
01-06-2006, 04:11 PM
Wow can that get anymore worse, almost looks like something reichel would make. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/pukeface.gif" BORDER="0">

IcedG35
01-06-2006, 04:16 PM
If this directly competes with teh Aston Martin, then it's kinda screwed IMO. But, i'm sure this will be overprices, just like teh AMV8 is, which will give Porsche the edge. It seems like Aston Martin is tryin to destroy Porsche, one model at a time.

Ascariss
01-06-2006, 04:20 PM
Destroy?<p>the 911 is great, the boxster is fantastic, the new cayman I heard is getting great reviews and well the cayenne, well that's the middle child and we'll leave him alone.<p>The panamera if judging by the sketch, will look better than the new AM 4 door.<p>As for money in this segment, kinda hard to judge if overpriced, since plopping down a 100K isn't what everyone does on a normal basis.<p>If you are buying a car over 100K then being overpriced isn't the term to be used, value for money is the key. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0"> I'll keep the talk of the amv8 out of this though.

Superfresa
01-06-2006, 04:38 PM
Wow that Huckfeldt impression looks extremely good. I hope Porsche finally finds a way to doing this NOW. Dont halt it again, now is the moment when the vehicle will have more success, seing the CLS and M5 have become popular and now Aston has the Lagonda thingie and Lamborghini will have a new gen espada. Now is the moment Porsche, especially if it looks similar to that huckfeldt chop.

IcedG35
01-06-2006, 04:43 PM
Yeah destroy may have been a strong word. It just seems like Porsche is definitely the company Aston Martin is targeting. I just think the Porsche wins in terms of value, because a AMV8 wasn't meant to go head to head wtih a 911 turbo, but it is priced to do so. I think Porsche will also be the better value in terms of this new car. While people may be able to afford the more expensive model, it doesn't mean they want to if they feel it is a bad value. I've seen poeple trying to argue over about $1000 while purchasing a DB9. I don't know if this is a correct statement, but it seems like Aston Martin's advertising as well as many car magazines are going to help Porsche. They keep comparing the AMV8 to the 911 adn it always comes down to price. Panamera may also be given this advantage, especially when they throw the Quattroporte, CLS55, and Flying Spur in there.

DSC-OFF
02-08-2006, 07:35 PM
<IMG SRC="http://www.autozeitung.de/pages/aktuelles_heft/images/ah_0406.jpg" BORDER="0"><p><A HREF="http://www.autozeitung.de" TARGET="_blank">AutoZeitung</A><br> <br>

harvick2921
02-14-2006, 03:17 PM
finally, familys can buy porsches, not just rich single people, lol.

odic
02-14-2006, 04:05 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>harvick2921</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">finally, familys can buy porsches, not just rich single people, lol. </TD></TR></TABLE><p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>wondering when volkswagen will become exclusive? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/1orglaugh.gif" BORDER="0">

the cheddar
02-16-2006, 08:14 PM
Hey, brands can evolve. Sometimes foolishly, sometimes not. But they can move upmarket, downmarket and even laterally (new segments) pretty easily. It's a big topic of debate among marketers now...

odic
02-17-2006, 01:35 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>the cheddar</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hey, brands can evolve. Sometimes foolishly, sometimes not. But they can move upmarket, downmarket and even laterally (new segments) pretty easily. It's a big topic of debate among marketers now...</TD></TR></TABLE><p>just a joke.<p>Sure brands can evolve, as you say. As for the Cayenne or the Panamera, Porsche-purists hate them, big bosses love them. <p>btw, are you a marketeer? i'm studying for it <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beerchug.gif" BORDER="0">

conan
02-17-2006, 02:01 AM
Very true. Personally, I feel the Cayenne is more a VW than it is a Porsche. The same with the upcoming Panamera, which will be assembled by VW.<p>Cayenne is based on the Touareg.<br>Panamera? Think the upcoming 4-door, Passat coupe.

Reppu
02-17-2006, 03:05 AM
Or the transaxle Maserati platform, if VAG can licence it to third parties.

the cheddar
02-17-2006, 10:28 AM
Yeah, but what is a car brand today, really? Everyone shares bits, manufacturing facilities, technology and even platforms. And VW and Porsche have ALWAYS been spiritual if not direct partners, trading engineering resources and technology. And many Porsches have been built by other companies (924 & 944 by Audi, Boxster by company in Finland, etc.). I suspect the Panamera will not be different in this regard. <p>Brands today exist in the minds of consumers more than in separate buildings or countries. National or brand character is something designed in upfront now. Otherwise, homogenous engineering resources (they come from the same schools and curriculi) are leveling the field and making the true differences between identities harder to find. Porsche Panamera will be no exception.<p>Yes, I'm in marketing -- Advertising and marketing strategist, background in journalism.

odic
02-17-2006, 10:51 AM
interesting question, what are brands today.<p>but out of that you're completely right. <p>and connan, i don't think it'll be based on the 4dour passat, but on the phaeton, which sales weren't that good. maybe production in the same factory. didn't they stopped making the phaeton?

the cheddar
02-17-2006, 11:47 AM
I think this will be a new, Porsche only platform. Seems that being sufficiently upmarket and spread accross other models (new 928) will make a case for profitability. But who knows, you never can tell if it might underpin or share components with a lower-end VW or Audi at some point...<p>Phaeton is still produced but has been withdrawn from this market (US), I think. I doubt that'll underpin a Porsche, given that it's currently the Phaeton, A8 and Bentley Continental GT & Flying Spur. <p>

Top Secret
02-17-2006, 10:03 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>the cheddar</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I think this will be a new, Porsche only platform.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Porsche's CEO, Wiedeking, has already stated that the Panamera will not be a joint venture with any other carmaker.<p><I>"Wiedeking stated that Porsche will be developing and building the Panamera through the Company's own resources: "We will be developing a separate platform for our fourth model series in Weissach. There are no plans for a joint venture with another car maker. But to ensure the profitability of this new model series we will cooperate more closely than so far with selected system suppliers."</I> <p>More: <A HREF="http://www.worldcarfans.com/news.cfm/newsID/2050727.008/country/gcf/porsche/porsche-will-build-panamera-sports-coup%C3%A9" TARGET="_blank">http://www.worldcarfans.com/ne...C3%A9</A>

against the wall
04-07-2006, 05:34 PM
<A HREF="http://www.worldcarfans.com/spyphotos.cfm/country/gcf/spyphotoID/6060407.003/porsche/first-porsche-panamera-spy-photos" TARGET="_blank">http://www.worldcarfans.com/sp...hotos</A><p>its about time they got to work on this.

Hornbag
04-08-2006, 03:15 AM
Looking very Cayenne in those spy pictures lol, but the basic platform is there somwehere, engoulphed by the mass of the truck, I mean Cayenne. Thanks yanksrule.

Guybrush Threepwood
04-08-2006, 04:34 AM
Hmm, that cant be right. I was told in December (and now I have seen it myself) that Porsche is using a wider BMW M5 as a mule. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0">

KebabGud
04-08-2006, 05:35 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Guybrush Threepwood</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Hmm, that cant be right. I was told in December (and now I have seen it myself) that Porsche is using a wider BMW M5 as a mule. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><br>now .. why whould porsche use a X5 as a mule .. when the can yuse any VW /audi ....

against the wall
04-08-2006, 06:03 AM
well whatever it is, that cayenne has definetly been modified to be a mule. and isnt the panamera going to be on the cayenne platform?<br>

IcedG35
04-08-2006, 01:42 PM
It can't be that cost efficient that almost every one of Porsche's models is on a different platform with a different drivetrain configuration. Is there any relation to a Boxter platform and a 911 platform? (sorry for getting off topic)

KebabGud
04-08-2006, 03:48 PM
911 and boxster/cayman has 2 completly diffrent platforms..<br>

iamalittlepepper
04-10-2006, 05:31 AM
yup eg Audi / Caymen uses the same tranny.. 911 is flipped (for obvious reason)<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>KebabGud</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">911 and boxster/cayman has 2 completly diffrent platforms..</TD></TR></TABLE>

DSC-OFF
05-17-2006, 01:23 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><B>Porsche is in the process of converting its Carrera GT production line at its Leipzig factory to be able to start production on the Panamera sedan in time for a possible launch early next year</B>. Porsche recently built the last of its Carrera GT supercars earlier this month. The Panamera is Porsche's response to the Mercedes-Benz CLS 55 AMG and Maserati Quattroporte and the Aston Martin Rapide. The Panamera's name is derived from the Carrera Panamericana race like the Porsche Carrera.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Unconfirmed intel<p><A HREF="http://www.sybarites.org/2006/05/13/porsche-to-begin-production-of-its-panamera-sedan/" TARGET="_blank">Sybarites</A><br> <br>

Top Secret
05-17-2006, 02:03 AM
Pfft, well, that's obviously wrong. Porsche themselves have stated that the Panamera will be an '09 model.

geary
05-17-2006, 02:31 AM
I was thinking the same, but don't forget retooling the production lines takes an absolute age, especially if they're aiming for greater volume than the Carrera GT, which I assume.<p>Apparently, retooling takes about a year on Hyundai lines, so I could only estimate Porsche would take longer.

ACURARDX
05-23-2006, 02:56 PM
<A HREF="http://blogs.edmunds.com/Straightline/1049" TARGET="_blank">http://blogs.edmunds.com/Straightline/1049</A><p>Although it's a BMW M5 but really it's a Porsche Panamera undergoing testing. Apparently the company has used everything from Cayennes to Audi and BMWs.

mzoltarp
05-23-2006, 03:15 PM
Clever, just like when they used Audi 100 shells to cloak the 928 prototypes. I know it won't happen, but I'm praying for some non 911 caricature styling.

Reppu
05-24-2006, 12:41 AM
I guess BMW agreed on this, but don't know why.

Ascariss
05-24-2006, 12:47 AM
Not really, all porsche had to do was buy a few m5s and then mod them, it's all legal, you own the car, all you do is void the warrenty lol.

Reppu
05-24-2006, 05:57 AM
Then why not buy the cheapest 5er instead of the M5, if you are going to cut metal anyway? Or for that purpose, any other car which measures fit. I don't get it, Porsche is willing to burn money or what?

mzoltarp
05-24-2006, 06:27 AM
in the grand scheme of spending hundreds of millions of dollars to bring a new vehicle to production an M5 is pennies.

AM2K
05-24-2006, 09:29 AM
Car manufacturers use this type of testing stragegy all the time. Vehicle development takes many years, and only a certain amount of time towards the end sees the actual prototypes with camofaluged bodies. These types of mules are good at hiding the true goings on underneath the car...

Ascariss
05-24-2006, 10:36 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Reppu</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Then why not buy the cheapest 5er instead of the M5, if you are going to cut metal anyway? Or for that purpose, any other car which measures fit. I don't get it, Porsche is willing to burn money or what?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>M5 was designed for intense crazy speeds, and over the hill handling, so very little is needed for porsche to mod it to get it near Panamera level. while the regular 5er would require a lot more work to modify it.

IcedG35
05-24-2006, 11:05 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Ascariss</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>M5 was designed for intense crazy speeds, and over the hill handling, so very little is needed for porsche to mod it to get it near Panamera level. while the regular 5er would require a lot more work to modify it.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>well wouldn't they be using Porsche parts for handling and chassis parts either way? i though they pretty much just keep a M5 body but change all the mechanics. anyone know the specifics of how much they change for test mules? I'm assuming the whole car has been modified, wheel base changed, etc

Ascariss
05-24-2006, 11:08 AM
Looking from that spy pic, no wheelbase change is apparent, only the width of the car, as seen by the new fenders.

Carlos
05-24-2006, 11:55 AM
Autoweek says that the fat M5 is a BMW Z6:<p><A HREF="http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060524/FREE/60523003/1065/BLOG02" TARGET="_blank">http://www.autoweek.com/apps/p...LOG02</A><br>

Ascariss
05-24-2006, 12:24 PM
hmm, wouldnt it be on Munich plates?

KebabGud
05-25-2006, 05:02 AM
wasent there seen porsche engineers with that "bmw"<br>

Klaus H.
06-19-2006, 07:07 AM
Hello,<p>the guy, who made this photo-shots, didnt kwow, what car this is. Its the same number-plate like the car on the Nrburgring-Nordschleife.<p><A HREF="http://www.7-forum.com/forum/showthread.html?t=55661&page=1&pp=10" TARGET="_blank">http://www.7-forum.com/forum/s...pp=10</A><p>Both cars have Porsche-driver-seats.<p>Best regards<br>Klaus

SHEPO
06-19-2006, 07:19 AM
Thanks for the info. One problem: can't see the pictures because we're not members. Could you post them please? (I don't understand German so I won't be able to make an account)

Klaus H.
06-19-2006, 07:44 AM
Hello,<p>I`ll try it. <p>Best regards.<br>Klaus<p>Edit: in another forum a german testdriver explains, that these cars are not Panameras, but white-body-m5 from tire-producers. The number-plate beginning with ERB is Pirelli, FB is Bridgestone.<p><br><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by Klaus H. at 8:24 AM 6/19/2006</i>

Ascariss
06-19-2006, 01:31 PM
I just checked out the pictures right now, doesn't seem to be anything but car companies, but although interestign setup with the flares.

StevenZoz
06-19-2006, 02:48 PM
yea i just registered and i didnt see anything

GoLeafsGO
08-02-2006, 04:50 PM
The Car Connection has a few photos and a few artists' impressions. Interesting - Porsche is driving around 2 test Panameras with other companies' bodies - the 5-series and A8 over the porsche running gear. cute.

Jack_Napier
08-02-2006, 05:17 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>GoLeafsGO</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The Car Connection has a few photos and a few artists' impressions. Interesting - Porsche is driving around 2 test Panameras with other companies' bodies - the 5-series and A8 over the porsche running gear. cute.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>The TCC rendering is a horrible photochop of a 350Z

Ascariss
08-02-2006, 05:24 PM
lol where on tcc, the blog?

Jack_Napier
08-02-2006, 05:26 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Ascariss</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">lol where on tcc, the blog?</TD></TR></TABLE><p><A HREF="http://www.thecarconnection.com/images/gallery/11076_MOOHLYUQOITTN.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.thecarconnection.co...N.jpg</A>

Ascariss
08-02-2006, 05:49 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Jack_Napier</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p><A HREF="http://www.thecarconnection.com/images/gallery/11076_MOOHLYUQOITTN.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.thecarconnection.co...N.jpg</A></TD></TR></TABLE><p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/scared.gif" BORDER="0"> that's not even a 4 door. the horror.

against the wall
08-02-2006, 06:02 PM
if its based on the 350z its a pretty good chop but doesnt he know what the panamera is? at least he couldve made it like the sketch.

Vltava
08-02-2006, 06:06 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Ascariss</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/scared.gif" BORDER="0"> that's not even a 4 door. the horror.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>TCC explains that:<p>Porsche is testing a set of prototypes that not only show the Panamera sedan on a quick course for development-they also suggest that the sportscar maker is planning a fifth model line along the lines of the former 928 coupe.<p>So that 350Z chop is supposed to be the new 928. Too bad Lehman is trying his hand at chops.

mzoltarp
08-02-2006, 08:43 PM
The fact that it is a 911 caricature is reason enough to dismiss it. Porsche clearly has precious little creativity if all they can do is to rehash the lines of a 1963 Porsche again and again and again. Something fresh and compelling would be delightful.

Ace of Spades
08-03-2006, 12:44 AM
Well, they never were sucessfull when they tried to deviate from it.

protocatcher
08-03-2006, 01:19 AM
Porsche is driving really strangely 928 mules at their test facility. So the guess is that they probably will make a 2 door version of the Panamera too. Would make sense, just shorten the Panamera platform and u get another modell for "free".<br>Would compete against the new Maserati Coupe and BMW 6-series.<br>Guess Porsche wants a frontengined coupe aswell.<p>But my opinion is .......a real Porsche has the engine BEHIND the driver ;-)

mzoltarp
08-03-2006, 06:16 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Berlango205</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well, they never were sucessfull when they tried to deviate from it.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>The 914 was quite popular in its day even if it wasn't the roadburner the 911 was. The 924 was reasonably successful, but the subsequent 944 was a big hit.

Ace of Spades
08-03-2006, 12:39 PM
Sorry if I couldn't say what I mean, indeed that three cars were successfull, but never in the way that 911 is, the fact that shows it the more is that it's STILL alive, and Porsche was trying to make its cars similar to it (Boxster is almost identical, Cayenne has the same front, Carrera GT... maybe the same but sleeker). What I wanna mean: they're gonna make its cars the most similar as possible with that old sport coupe that we all know, because in the past they tried to deviate from this "winning" formula, but the results weren't enough to save the company (all the times the company was near to death, along came the 911, and maybe the Boxster, to save the day). <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.forumsforjustice.org/forums/images/smilies/sponge.gif" BORDER="0">

mzoltarp
08-04-2006, 03:11 PM
A front-engined rear-drive V6 coupe the size of a Corrado for 30-35k is probably necessary as the Boxster and the Caiman move to higher ground. The 3.6 VW VR6 with a rear mounted transaxle with some sort of tiptronic or paddle shifter would be a delightful card to play against the BMW 3 series.

against the wall
08-04-2006, 08:23 PM
but doesnt VAG have the a4/new a5 to go against the 3?

mzoltarp
08-04-2006, 09:06 PM
The Audis are front drive or all wheel drive and run close seconds to the BMW 3 series. A front engined rear drive coupe that is simplicity personified would be refreshing.

HondaLagreat
08-09-2006, 12:13 AM
Here are links to the pictures "Klaus" was trying to show us... I uploaded them on my server.<p><A HREF="http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/upload/files/3/24-05-06_0803.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/...3.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/upload/files/3/24-05-06_0802.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/...2.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/upload/files/3/24-05-06_0805.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/...5.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/upload/files/3/24-05-06_0804.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/...4.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/upload/files/3/24-05-06_0801.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://www.cycloneinjapan.com/...1.jpg</A>

Blob
08-09-2006, 02:08 AM
whats with the pics of the 5 series????

against the wall
08-09-2006, 11:06 AM
porsche is using the bodies of other car companies for mules of their cars. like this one. if you ask me its very very clever.

Porschefan
08-09-2006, 06:10 PM
No one would know better than to think it was at most a <i>Bimmer</i> mule, not a Porsche one...

against the wall
08-09-2006, 06:27 PM
thats exactly what they want you to think. i think someone said that was what porsche did.

Vormund
08-09-2006, 07:08 PM
I know Porsche used Merc's in the past. Although somebody slipped up and put Porsche rims on the mule. :D

phi
08-10-2006, 12:28 PM
I've read in another forum that the fat M5s are only test mules for tire manufacturers. They have such a wide body, that every single type of tire fits on this mule.

gyro1
08-14-2006, 06:44 PM
They're only renderings but apparently there might be a new V10 based on the Carrera GT engine used.<p><A HREF="http://www.motorauthority.com/cars/porsche/preview-2009-porsche-panamera" TARGET="_blank">http://www.motorauthority.com/...amera</A>/

Porschefan
08-14-2006, 07:00 PM
Wow, apparently Porsche's really going to stick to the four-door coupe theme. At least according to these renderings. Both look a little to hastily put together to tell what it will really look like. I hope someone will catch a mule that actually looks like the car soon...

CosworthKid
08-14-2006, 07:17 PM
Those renderings are horrible! I sure hope the actual car will look great. Im in favour of Porsche finaly giving way to a design that doesnt rely on the 911 but it needs to be something good,sporty yet have some class

gyro1
08-14-2006, 07:36 PM
i for one hope that porsche implement the old school Prosche name on the rear panel. I still love the cars from the 80's era much more than any of Porsche's new stuff.

Ascariss
08-14-2006, 07:44 PM
Why start a new thread? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> When you can post in the existing one? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> It's not even archived ffs, second page of this section top.<p>I also should mention spamming our own car blog site is a bad thing and I view it as advertising, now you wouldn't be doing that would you? almost seems like you are, registered today, and posted a new thread, to a car from some new blog which i never heard off. I don't like eating or reading <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/spam.gif" BORDER="0">.

gyro1
08-14-2006, 11:46 PM
My own car blog site? Sorry mate, I don't have anything to do with it. If someone had asked me yesterday what carspyshots.net was I would have said it sounds like a dodgy website run by someone who can't even get a .com name. But it isn't, is it? <p>It's time to get your hand off it, and I don't mean the gearstick.

Ascariss
08-14-2006, 11:52 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>gyro1</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">My own car blog site? Sorry mate, I don't have anything to do with it. If someone had asked me yesterday what carspyshots.net was I would have said it sounds like a dodgy website run by someone who can't even get a .com name. But it isn't, is it? <p>It's time to get your hand off it, and I don't mean the gearstick. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>don't like it here? no one is forcing you to post or visit. your post was suspicious that is why i replied, we've had spammers here before on the intent of driving traffic to their own site. second next time check before starting a new thread.

Comrade
08-15-2006, 10:55 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>gyro1</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They're only renderings but apparently there might be a new V10 based on the Carrera GT engine used.<p><A HREF="http://www.motorauthority.com/cars/porsche/preview-2009-porsche-panamera" TARGET="_blank">http://www.motorauthority.com/...amera</A>/</TD></TR></TABLE><br>That website isn't very Safari friendly is it.. Every time I click on it, Safari closes down. Does anyone else have this problem??

Spy Guy
09-13-2006, 01:05 AM
Here we have the first real Spy Shot:<p> <A HREF="http://foto.arcor-online.net/palb/alben/11/88111/1280_6264613137386262.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://foto.arcor-online.net/p...2.jpg</A> <p>Source: Auto Motor und Sport

scorpio14
09-13-2006, 01:14 AM
Lookin good in that picture... i guess all the illustration are very similar to this in terms of the general shape of the car.

the future
09-13-2006, 01:18 AM
What's that? The new Tatraplan?

the1
09-13-2006, 02:32 AM
Yuck! I hope the final shape is not 100% similar to that prototype.

geary
09-13-2006, 03:14 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>the1</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yuck! I hope the final shape is not 100% similar to that prototype.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I think you're looking at the real deal. Interesting to see a spoiler on the 4-door, but, if you think about it, it seems logical for the coupe style.<p>There's quite a bizarre surface line above the rear window, which adds a 'back' to the car, which gives this shot the weighty and not-so-sleek look. If you follow that line, the shape of the car seems more Porsche like, and much better.<p>Only interesting to note the indent on the front door - 3/4 line - looks like there could be a vent there, which I'm not so sure about.

the1
09-13-2006, 03:30 AM
i hope it won't have that hump. The back window's line is clearly different.

Gian86
09-13-2006, 04:24 AM
Real Metal Spy Panamera unveiled!!!!<br>My thoughts would be for now is i really think Panamera does look like as 911 Sedan.

the1
09-13-2006, 04:41 AM
Nothing revolutionary, then. I thought the Panamera won't be launched until 2009. A lightly camoed prototype is already testing?

Reppu
09-13-2006, 04:53 AM
Oh oh.....this is not looking good. At all. I hope they don't make a new styling mistake as they did with the Cayenne, mostly after they showed their skills with the magnificent Cayman.

mzoltarp
09-13-2006, 05:22 AM
The insistance that the sedan look like a 911 makes it look rather odd.

phi
09-13-2006, 06:01 AM
i think thats the problem of porsche - they think, that porsches are only bought, if they look like a 911.<br>in fact they are bought because they are a porsche. but porsche doesn't realise this and no matter what the model is, they put a 911 face on it. the cayenne looks stupid with those 911 headlights - but they could even crash it against a wall and put a porsche badge on it - it still will be bought.<p>i saw a good rendering last time --&gt;<br><A HREF="http://imageshack.us" TARGET="_blank"><IMG SRC="http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/5554/7163580x0x85qn4.jpg" BORDER="0"></A><p>this is one hell of a car - it doesn't have the same back end as the 911 has and the cayman has as well, but they are not that selfconscious to style a new car, i think

bolita
09-13-2006, 06:52 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Reppu</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Oh oh.....this is not looking good. At all. I hope they don't make a new styling mistake as they did with the Cayenne, mostly after they showed their skills with the magnificent Cayman.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I'm with you 100% I thought it would have some other non-911 look. Porsche could easily evolve its design away from the 911...

CosworthKid
09-13-2006, 07:40 AM
What a major dissapointed <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> I was getting really excited by this, having seen initial suggestive CG's and chops but this is just too lame. I had to accept the monster looks of the Cayenne cause i though "ok, its an SUV so it will look strange for a Porsche"...but this? Sorry but i do not want to see another 911 look-alike for the rest of my life. The Aston Martin 4-door seems like a far better attempt. Sure this is a heavily disguised car but i do not dig the 911 look, seriously now, its starting to become annoying. Wake up Porsche!

Spy Guy
09-13-2006, 07:47 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>the1</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">A lightly camoed prototype is already testing?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>No, this car is HEAVY camouflaged. The complete bodykit is made out of plastic and even the spoiler is camo.

the1
09-13-2006, 07:56 AM
I see. Then the general shape, even if evolutionary, could be good. As long as that hump is camouflage, too.

against the wall
09-13-2006, 11:58 AM
this looks nothing like the sketch <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0">

protocatcher
09-13-2006, 01:13 PM
The pic is actually not a "real" spypic , its made by Porsche . They wanted some publicity and released a pic of their own . <br>But i guess they will drive some of their prototypes out on the streets in very short time .

bm88
09-14-2006, 03:57 AM
The camo on the rear window makes it look like a Lincoln TownCar!

Ace of Spades
09-14-2006, 04:53 AM
Nobody can trust Porsche's maneuvers to distract people interested in their future cars. Anyone remember when they released a supposed "photo" of their coming "980" supercar with a 5.5 V10, and it was a simple photoshopped 911 GT1? They made it for distracting attention from the real definitive deal, the Carrera GT (that, by the way, has the 980 internal code). Also, they always cover the head and rear lights to confuse people about the actual shape. There are many examples. I think it's real clever.

HXC Performance
09-15-2006, 06:13 PM
That test mule looks SOO terrible.. the lines remind me of the Infiniti G35.. they dont even come CLOSE to the original sketches released by Porsche..<p>Very disappointed already... people are going to ***** at this post.. but i dont care how much different the actual car looks, that TERRIBLE Belt Line is there to stay. G35 Infiniti, just terrible

the1
09-16-2006, 10:57 AM
We should wait for the final look, anyway.

randy59
09-16-2006, 11:55 PM
Yeah. I don't think this can possibly be the real sheet metal. Porsche ususally does a much better job. I am concerned about the interior though. Am I the only one that thinks the interior of the Cayenne is terrible? Especially for the price, I think the interior is completely unacceptable. The buyer of a sedan in the price range this car will certainly be in won't settle for something that isn't trend setting. It will be interesting to see what they do.

the1
09-17-2006, 09:56 AM
The car is still a few years away and I do think Porsche is capable of launching something really cool and groundbreaking.

the1
09-19-2006, 06:06 PM
<A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/1-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/2-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/3-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/5-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><p><br>Spied again: 2009 Porsche Panamera<br>sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg<p>Porsche's Wendelin Wiedeking announced in an interview just days ago that the automaker's new Panamera four-door "coupe" began its testing marathon at the challenging Nürburgring over the last week. Now, spy photographer Brenda Priddy has snapped some photos of one of the first prototypes, still wearing heavy disguise. The entry-level powerplant will be Volkswagen’s 3.5-liter six-cylinder engine with 300 bhp, while Porsche’s own drivetrain will be a direct-injection eight-cylinder petrol engine, available in naturally-aspirated guise (350 bhp) and with twin-turbo (560 bhp). When it hits the road in 2009, Porsche hopes to be able to sell 20 000 units annually. In late 2005, a Porsche spokesperson said the automaker would unveil a concept version of the car in spring 2007. So far, Porsche has only released an official sketch of the car. Leftalanenews

knicks125
09-20-2006, 07:28 AM
Those links don't work:<p><A HREF="http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?DID=RSS&n=178&sid=178&article=10879" TARGET="_blank">http://www.thecarconnection.co...10879</A>

Ascariss
09-20-2006, 09:05 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>the1</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/1-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/2-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/3-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/5-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br> </TD></TR></TABLE><p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>knicks125</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Those links don't work:<p><A HREF="http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?DID=RSS&n=178&sid=178&article=10879" TARGET="_blank">http://www.thecarconnection.co...10879</A></TD></TR></TABLE><p>That is because the site changed the url, <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0"> <p><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/11-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/12-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/13-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/14-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/15-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://images.leftlanenews.com/content/16-sep19-2009-porsche-panamera.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://images.leftlanenews.com...a.jpg</A><p>

knihc2008
09-20-2006, 10:04 PM
Looks like it might go well. Looks really bloated with all that camo and I hope it doesn't look so fat, heavy and thick with it all.

LEXUS FAN!
09-20-2006, 10:25 PM
is this a mule...or is it a real prodcution version covered in camo?...cause it seems early for the production version's design to be finalized already

the1
09-21-2006, 01:08 AM
It should be a mule, but the general shape seems to match the sketch.

mick78
09-21-2006, 03:48 AM
I'm pretty sure it's the real car - they wouldn't camo a mule so heavily...<p>Judging from the pictures, interior space won't be a strength of this car.

Roadster44
09-21-2006, 07:24 AM
Porsche is simply generating interest with a mildly camoed car. Nice way to get some down payments.

gumba3ah
09-21-2006, 02:04 PM
<A HREF="http://news.windingroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/09/panamera-1.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://news.windingroad.com/wp...1.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://news.windingroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/09/panamera-2.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://news.windingroad.com/wp...2.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://news.windingroad.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/09/panamera-3.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://news.windingroad.com/wp...3.jpg</A><p>these are the best shots yet of the panamera<p>

zergcerebrates
09-21-2006, 02:11 PM
Eww. I would buy the Aston Martin Rapide over this. The artist impressions of the panamera was so much better.

the1
09-21-2006, 02:13 PM
I would assume there'll also be a considerable price difference between the 2.

against the wall
09-21-2006, 03:34 PM
between this, the rapide and the quattroporte, i choose the quattroporte. just because its damn sexy as hell and isnt as high priced as the other 2 (or as high as the porsche could come out to be). the rapide is an extremely close second in the looks department though.

odic
09-22-2006, 12:20 AM
if so, it could be a huge seller, like the cayenne, but i assume no (diehard) porsche fan will buy it

ypos
09-22-2006, 04:37 AM
<A HREF="http://pix.nofrag.com/6d/6c/e4087fdc0528e46e6d167e5264ce.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://pix.nofrag.com/6d/6c/e4...e.jpg</A><br><A HREF="http://pix.nofrag.com/06/26/bc10e2df9d641e1008580a5a5343.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://pix.nofrag.com/06/26/bc...3.jpg</A><p><IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0">

jl215
09-22-2006, 07:50 AM
Can't wait to see a Panamera turbooo duke it out with the M5/M6

against the wall
09-22-2006, 11:30 AM
dunno if anyone noticed but that spoiler is retractable.

The Spy
09-22-2006, 12:05 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>against the wall</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">dunno if anyone noticed but that spoiler is retractable.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Just like the Turbo's...and it's the same type of camouflage. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0">

against the wall
09-22-2006, 12:09 PM
you thinkin v10?

Hives
09-24-2006, 08:10 AM
What's with these names of late? I think some cars- "Panamera," "Veracruz" are starting to sound like a sandwich you'd get at some stripmall-lifestyle cafe.<p>"I'll have the Meatball Panamera with no onions please and extra shrimp with my Veracruz burrito." <p>Provided the Porsche doesn't turn out to be an obviously marketer-driven and bean-counter choked joke, I think it'd be sexier to have a unique alpha-numeric name. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/biggrin.gif" BORDER="0"> <p><br><BR><BR>
<i>Modified by Hives at 8:23 AM 9/24/2006</i>

mzoltarp
09-24-2006, 10:31 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Hives</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What's with these names of late? I think it'd be sexier to have a unique alpha-numeric name. <i>Modified by Hives at 8:23 AM 9/24/2006</i></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Panamericana would have made more sense historically. What would make it sexier would be for Porsche to develop some new styling language instead of the constant barrage of 911 styling cliches. It is so disappointing to see a company like Porsche that is so adept at engineering yet so fearful of anything they do NOT looking like a 911. The 911 vocabulary is 41 years old. It's time for some dynamic, fresh thinking.

Comrade
09-27-2006, 03:01 PM
<A HREF="http://img85.imageshack.us/img85/3532/panamerasnh0.jpg" TARGET="_blank">http://img85.imageshack.us/img...0.jpg</A> <p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0">

against the wall
09-27-2006, 05:08 PM
looks better than the blue thing. but the rear seems squished and disproportionate. in my opinion, that should be a regular coupe, and just have it compete with the fiorano.

Speedstick
09-28-2006, 09:20 AM
Nice pics, but I think the pillar in the rear windows was fake (and it looks much better without it).

mzoltarp
09-28-2006, 08:35 PM
The blue thing look infinitely better and the blue thing is terrible. The proportions of this latest rendering are scarily bad.

carbon
10-27-2006, 07:09 AM
new pics of a green car<p><A HREF="http://www.worldcarfans.com/spyphotos.cfm/country/gcf/spyphotoID/6061027.003/porsche/spy-photos-porsche-panamera-latest" TARGET="_blank">http://www.worldcarfans.com/sp...atest</A>

erzhik
10-27-2006, 08:02 AM
I hope they don't plan to produce green ones..

mzoltarp
10-27-2006, 04:02 PM
I hope they plan more graceful proportions.

zebby
10-27-2006, 05:20 PM
It almost looks like they have just streched a 911, and stuck some rear doors on it. I though they would be a bit more work into the design. Oh sorry, it is Porsche. Just have to wait till it is shown, and then decide if ti looks good.

JBlair
10-27-2006, 07:52 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>zebby</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It almost looks like they have just streched a 911, and stuck some rear doors on it. I though they would be a bit more work into the design. Oh sorry, it is Porsche. Just have to wait till it is shown, and then decide if ti looks good.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>To be fair, though, a lot of the sheetmetal is hidden under camo, so its hard to tell exactly how the final car will look.

Gromit
10-28-2006, 03:57 AM
These are the people who styled the Cayenne and the Boxster. They're capable of anything.

mzoltarp
10-28-2006, 04:43 AM
Even assuming that most of the sheetmetal is hidden under camo, the proportions make it look obese. The people who styled the Cayenne, Boxster, and Cayman are clearly only able to reinterpret the 911.

Redline
10-28-2006, 07:30 AM
It's a little unfair to call all of Porsche's models 911 re-hashes. I would say that it's just an example of brand identity. Perhaps a bit of an extreme one, but still, brand identity. That said I personally think this could turn out a lot better than I expected from the looks of things. It should turn out pretty nicely actually.

mzoltarp
10-28-2006, 09:53 AM
Most ridiculous item of the day: The same level of brand identity if applied to Volkswagen would result in everything having to look like the Beetle, and yes, that would be ridiculous.

The Spy
10-28-2006, 11:23 AM
No, the<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Gromit</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">These are the people who styled the Cayenne and the Boxster. They're capable of anything.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>No, they're not!<IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0"> They changed their chief designer...