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Comrade
12-13-2005, 12:03 PM
The new Audi <B>R10</B><br><IMG SRC="http://www.fourtitude.com/news/uploads/Motorsport_News/005__scaled_600_004.jpg" BORDER="0"><br>Article + pictures: <A HREF="http://www.fourtitude.com/news/publish/Motorsport_News/article_1852.shtml" TARGET="_blank">http://www.fourtitude.com/news...shtml</A><br>

gone with the wind
12-13-2005, 12:50 PM
Why it is called <b>R10</b> while it have a 5.5 litre V12 Biturbo TDI engine. ???<p>wfg, Hans.

MitzXJ220
12-13-2005, 02:23 PM
Great car!!! 650 BHP from a diesel!!!<p>What I don't understand, so please can someone enlighten me, is how can you have a diesel engine with an aluminium block?<p>Also, what on earth are they going to do with FSI? Are they going to continue to develop it?

knihc2008
12-13-2005, 02:45 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Iceman</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why it is called <b>R10</b> while it have a 5.5 litre V12 Biturbo TDI engine. ???<p>wfg, Hans.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>i believe the last one was called the R9.. and the one before that was the R8...

Comrade
12-13-2005, 06:33 PM
There was no R9, only R8. The R8 had a 3.6L V8. I defn. have no idea why they name it R10 instead of R12 ...or R9 for that matter. <br>I wonder if we'll see diesel aluminum engines in production cars. That would be so good, if Audi made it possible.

erzhik
12-13-2005, 07:02 PM
looks like another Le Mans winner..

Reppu
12-14-2005, 12:27 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>comrade</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I wonder if we'll see diesel aluminum engines in production cars. That would be so good, if Audi made it possible.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>The 2.2 diesel of the european Accord is an all aluminium engine, and i don't think they owe it to Audi. The technology is already available.

62Lincoln
12-14-2005, 10:20 AM
Audi just affirmed their technical leadership with this bold announcement. I hope they have great success at Le Mans.

taskbearer
12-14-2005, 12:15 PM
<br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>comrade</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I wonder if we'll see diesel aluminum engines in production cars. That would be so good, if Audi made it possible.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Like reppu said the technology is already here.<br>The now outdated Isuzu 3.0L V6 diesel in SAAB 9-5 and Renault VelSatis had aluminum block.<br>the other aluminum block diesel engines include;<br>Peugeot's 1.4 and 1.6L HDi diesels<br>Honda's 2.2CTDi <br>Mercedes 3L V6 and 4L V8 diesels<br>BMW's 3L I6 and 4.4L V8 diesels<br>VW's I5 diesel in touareg<br>and finally VW's 5.5L V10(which uses two seperate aluminum blocks bolted to a common cast-iron base)<p>so aluminum is already in heavy use for diesels.<p>The first thing I thought after haering R10 was that the car would be powered by a V10 diesel. last year a Lola from the Taurus team was powered a modified VW tuareg V10, but suffered from pump seal failure and excessive torque overwhelming the chasis.<p>The V12 chosen by audi seems to be a technical decision to overcome the torque problem . Its safe to speculate that the engine has an oversquare combustion chamber to achieve high revs.<p><br>Lets all know that Audi is not alone. Peugeot was the first to announce a Lemans diesel contender in June and they are using a 5.4 V10. 2007 would be a year to watch with two strong diesel contenders and Porshe's LM P2 race car. <p>

Comrade
12-14-2005, 12:43 PM
Wow thanks for the info taskbearer, I know you have a lot of knowledge about diesels <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthup.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emwink.gif" BORDER="0"><br>Somewhere I heard that a diesel engine MUST be iron, but now I see it's not true at all. plus imagine how much the V10 in the Touareg would weigh if it wasn't Al.

phaeton
12-18-2005, 04:59 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Iceman</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why it is called <b>R10</b> while it have a 5.5 litre V12 Biturbo TDI engine. ???<p>wfg, Hans.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Maybe 10 LeMans victorys who knows <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0">

Jordmaniac
12-21-2005, 01:51 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>comrade</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">There was no R9, only R8. The R8 had a 3.6L V8. I defn. have no idea why they name it R10 instead of R12 ...or R9 for that matter. <br>I wonder if we'll see diesel aluminum engines in production cars. That would be so good, if Audi made it possible.</TD></TR></TABLE> <p>yeah the r9 will indeed, be the production version of the le mans concept

bolita
12-21-2005, 03:06 PM
There are several other examples of aluminum diesels but to clarify, the block is aluminum but the cylinders are still iron. I remember back in 1990, the Jeep Cherokee with the export Turbo Diesel Renault engine was also aluminum...<p>In any case, I remember that some years back SEAT planned to participate in the WRC with a Diesel. I think it never happened...

AXLE
12-21-2005, 07:41 PM
The block can be Aluminum but the combustion chamber liners MUST be iron. Let us not forget that Diesels do not work in the same way that internal combustion engines do but rather with high pressure and the heat generated by this compression inturn igniting the Diesel fuel. Diesel fuel has high combustion temperature. Aluminum has a low melting point, much lower than iron thus iron must be used regardless so these engines can not be all aluminum. Additional parts of the Diesel engine that cannot be all Aluminum are the engine heads.

taskbearer
12-23-2005, 09:33 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>AXLE</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The block can be Aluminum but the combustion chamber liners MUST be iron.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Yes for most Alu diesel engines, but not necesary. VW has already made a breakthrough with their V10 and I5 tdi engines <A HREF="http://www.kolbenschmidt.de/pdfdoc/vw_r5_gb_e.pdf" TARGET="_blank">http://www.kolbenschmidt.de/pdfdoc/vw_r5_gb_e.pdf</A>.<br>Notice that the engines have no cast iron liners. VW uses a high voltage plasma spray to harden the cylinder walls. Simplyfying the production process and saving weight.<p>The technique is so effective that the aluminum block engines have the same 88mm center to center distance between cylinder bores as their iron block counterparts. For comparison Mercedes' V6 diesel with cast iron liners has 101mm.<p>Of course the technology would spread and cast iron liners would become a past time. <p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>AXLE</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">.......... regardless so these engines can not be all aluminum. Additional parts of the Diesel engine that cannot be all Aluminum are the engine heads.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>I am certain that almost EVERY passengercar diesel engine in production today uses aluminum for the cylinder head. Cast iron heads have been as obsolete in diesels as they are in petrols. <p>Of course the whole engine cannot be aluminum, same with petrol engines as they contain steel valves,connecting rods and camshafts;and more and<br>more plastic parts. e.tc.

SHEPO
12-31-2005, 12:17 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Iceman</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Why it is called <b>R10</b> while it have a 5.5 litre V12 Biturbo TDI engine. ???<p>wfg, Hans.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>because if it was called R55, mercedes would be up in arms about it <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0">