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AXIS
01-19-2005, 11:07 AM
<b>Grilles Gone Wild!</b><p><i>by PHIL PATTON</i><p>For three years, Dany Garand, a designer at Audi,labored to make the next version of the company's flagship luxury sedan, the A8, as stately, dynamic and well-proportioned as possible. Then he got a new boss. <p>Walter de'Silva, who arrived in 2002 to take charge of design for the Audi group in the Volkswagen organization, decreed that the car should have a new trademark grille - a large upright trapezoid inspired by the 1930's racecars of Auto Union, an early parent company of Audi. In making the new grille fit, Mr. Garand was faced with a task as bloody as the swap of physiognomies conducted by John Travolta and Nicolas Cage in the 1997 film "Face/Off." <p>The grille is not just a feature of the car's face, it is a keynote of its design. That grilles are getting bigger - taller in particular - was quite evident at the 2005 Detroit auto show, which opened for press previews of new models Jan. 9. <p>The use of the supersize Audi grille has since spread from A8 sedans equipped with the top-of-the-line W-12 engine to the redesigned A6 model, and it will be on the new A4 that arrives in the United States this spring. <p>Chrysler's 300 sedan wears a grille that is huge in proportion to the car's overall size, reminiscent of old Bentleys; the scaled-up grille implies that there is a bigger, hungrier engine behind it. It screams "Hemi V-8," even if a particular 300 is fitted with a less ferocious V-6. Chrysler's designers have used this approach before, as in Dodge pickups with grilles that mimicked the look of Mack and Kenworth trucks.<p>Subaru has a lot riding on a new look it unveiled at the Detroit show. The rounded triangular grille - roughly the shape of a guitar pick - of its B9 Tribeca, a seven-seat sport utility wagon, is the key to fresh design motifs aimed at revising the company's image, according to Andreas Zapatinas, the Tribeca's designer. Previously used on design studies shown in Europe and Japan, the grille is inspired by the cross section of an aircraft fuselage and the intake of a jet engine, said Mr. Zapatinas. <p>The revised look suggests Subaru's new design language, based on the idea that aircraft engineering principles also apply to automobiles. But some see other messages in its expression.<p>"The raised upper lip of the grille and the downward slope at the corners of the grille's mouth bring to mind words like bitter and snarly," said Daniel Hill, president of Sensory Logic, a marketing firm that interprets facial expressions for corporate clients, when asked to apply his techniques to the Subaru. In an e-mail message, Dr. Hill also offered an analysis of the Audi, equating the height of its grille with supremacy and authority, while its open-mouth appearance suggested fear and surprise. <p>Grilles are the mouths of the car's face, but they are also the family crests of brands. Bigger grilles may be necessary to distinguish vehicles at a time when "down the road graphics" - a term designers use to describe the signature visual elements of a car in motion - differ less and less. The grille is like the coat of arms on a knight's shield; its shape and detail are part of a message of defiance and aggression, tradition and totem. <p>In the years that aerodynamics drove styling trends, grilles shrank, sometimes leaving cars looking mouthless. The original Ford Taurus of 1986 showed little more on its face than an oval opening. A Volkswagen Passat of the late 1980's seemed ineffectual without any hint of a grille; coming generations of VW's will more than compensate. The 2006 Passat, which goes on sale here late this year, will have a prominent grille. <p>The Audi grille is, well, polarizing. The British magazine Autocar referred to it as a "snout."<p>"Have you pulled out your pictures of the Edsel recently and compared them with the Audi?" asked J Mays, group vice president for design at Ford, who was once in charge of Audi design. <p>Mr. Mays is bucking the trend to bigger and taller grilles, at least on passenger cars. On future Fords, beginning with the 2006 Fusion sedan, the grille will be three horizontal bars, a relatively simple look foreshadowed in 2003 on the 427 concept car. <p>Before they became symbolic features, grilles protected the radiators behind them. But as cooling systems grew more efficient and radiators shrank over the years, the need for large grilles diminished. That may change: the most striking array of grille and cooling ducts at the Detroit show was seen on a General Motors design study, the Sequel, whose fuel-cell powertrain generates enormous amounts of heat. <p><i>originally published in the New York Times</i><br><A HREF="http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01/17/automobiles/17CARS.html" TARGET="_blank">http://www.nytimes.com/2005/01....html</A>

Naga Royal Guard
01-19-2005, 07:02 PM
stupid grille has no buisiness on an audi, they used to be such nice cars :(

syclone
01-22-2005, 10:49 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Naga Royal Guard</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">stupid grille has no buisiness on an audi, they used to be such nice cars :(</TD></TR></TABLE><p>You're joking right? Has the new A6 come out in the states yet. If so, I suggest you go to your local Audi dealer where you will proceed to drool for several hours. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0">

RS
01-22-2005, 11:19 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>syclone</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>You're joking right? Has the new A6 come out in the states yet. If so, I suggest you go to your local Audi dealer where you will proceed to drool for several hours. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><br> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beerchug.gif" BORDER="0"> I know I did. Have you seen it in that new Canyon Red color? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0"> It's got to be my favorite, but I haven't seen one in white yet, which could fit the car really good! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0">

Top Secret
01-23-2005, 12:06 AM
But the fact of the matter is, the bigger the grille is, the more presence it has - just look at the Phantom, and the 300C to a lesser scale. I personally love big grilles, especially the Audi 'shield' grilles.

syclone
01-23-2005, 08:05 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>RS</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beerchug.gif" BORDER="0"> I know I did. Have you seen it in that new Canyon Red color? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>yes. it rocks.

whipster
01-24-2005, 01:18 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">But the fact of the matter is, the bigger the grille is, the more presence it has - just look at the Phantom, and the 300C to a lesser scale. I personally love big grilles, especially the Audi 'shield' grilles.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>You're right, but big grilles fit only in luxury cars. Can you imagine Renault Megane or Fiat Panda with a huuuge grille? <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/pukeface.gif" BORDER="0"> <br>Small ones are also sexy, just look at Toyota Celica.

Top Secret
01-24-2005, 01:57 AM
Yes, I see what you mean, but still, big grilles so looks damn good ON THE CARS THEY ARE NOW ON, but I wouldn't really want to see a lot of cars get a big grille. <p>And yes, small grilles can look incredibly sexy, just look at even the kidney grilles on the BMW's, but what I really hate is when they have no grille at all. Just the badge on solid metal and that's it.

whipster
01-24-2005, 02:08 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Top Secret</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> what I really hate is when they have no grille at all. Just the badge on solid metal and that's it.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Usually that's right, but still, NO GRILLE AT ALL combination is now fashionable and quite many cars have this. Especially sporty ones. If so, it however looks hot (Lamborghini for instance). Personally I also think that Fiat Punto II before facelift (without proper grille) looks tones better than one after facelift.

RS
01-24-2005, 03:19 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>: wHiPsTEr :</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Usually that's right, but still, NO GRILLE AT ALL combination is now fashionable and quite many cars have this. Especially sporty ones. If so, it however looks hot (Lamborghini for instance). Personally I also think that Fiat Punto II before facelift (without proper grille) looks tones better than one after facelift.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>Rear-engine cars are different though. Where would all the air go?<br>The C5 Corvette had no grill at all and I like Covettes much better with a grill like the C6.<br>Whipster, you say that quite many cars have no grill, can you name some?

whipster
01-25-2005, 12:09 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>RS</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>Whipster, you say that quite many cars have no grill, can you name some?</TD></TR></TABLE><br>Yes but...<br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>RS</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>Rear-engine cars are different though. Where would all the air go?<br></TD></TR></TABLE><br>I haven't thought about this. You're right of course. However, there could be a pseudo-grille, just for good styling.

Monkey
01-27-2005, 06:14 AM
Grills on cars follow trends...just like most other changeable aspects of a car. Look at body styles from the 40's on. Square -&gt; rounded -&gt; squared -&gt; rounded....<br>Headlights go from small to large, to hidden, to large again.<br>Same with grills. Look at cars in the mid-80's. Grills started getting smaller, or tried to be hidden. Think Beretta, Cavalier back then. We're just on the opposite style now. In 10 years, we'll be back to hiding the fact that cars have grills.

carrera4
01-27-2005, 06:41 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Monkey</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Grills on cars follow trends...just like most other changeable aspects of a car. Look at body styles from the 40's on. Square -&gt; rounded -&gt; squared -&gt; rounded....<br>Headlights go from small to large, to hidden, to large again.<br>Same with grills. Look at cars in the mid-80's. Grills started getting smaller, or tried to be hidden. Think Beretta, Cavalier back then. We're just on the opposite style now. In 10 years, we'll be back to hiding the fact that cars have grills.</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I completely agree, I would like to see someone going against the trends...<br>

RS
01-27-2005, 03:28 PM
Well, it was the 80's. Go figure...

Monkey
02-05-2005, 10:15 AM
With Ford, we might be getting back to smaller grills sooner than later. Well, at least less open ones. The Fusion (and 500's restyle) look a lot like the 427 concept's. Large flat chrome bars. <br>Also look at the size of some GM future cars like the Sky, Solstice. They are fairly small.

Hornbag
02-05-2005, 06:36 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>carrera4</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I would like to see someone going against the trends...<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>BMW did with their new styling, and although we dont have cars that look identical, we see lots of elements from BMW's designs on other cars. The fact is, if something looks good, someone is going to copy it. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beigesmilewinkgrin.gif" BORDER="0">

Naga Royal Guard
02-05-2005, 06:44 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>syclone</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You're joking right? Has the new A6 come out in the states yet. If so, I suggest you go to your local Audi dealer where you will proceed to drool for several hours. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/icondrool.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>saw it on the highway, the side and back are great, but the front is so hoo huum <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> i dont like it much really

knicks125
02-05-2005, 09:26 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Naga Royal Guard</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>saw it on the highway, the side and back are great, but the front is so hoo huum <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> i dont like it much really</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Agree with Naga, the new front looks hideous, they should've kept the previous gen's front...looks much better<p>bigger is not better (sometimes) <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beigesmilewinkgrin.gif" BORDER="0">

RS
02-06-2005, 08:27 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Naga Royal Guard</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>saw it on the highway, the side and back are great, but the front is so hoo huum <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> i dont like it much really</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I rather have it look agressive than "<IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> " too.<br>Here like the only angle or picture from which the A6 doesn't look <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emsad.gif" BORDER="0"> :<br><IMG SRC="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v487/Chunkomatic/076__scaled_601.jpg" BORDER="0"><br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>knicks125</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Agree with Naga, the new front looks hideous, they should've kept the previous gen's front...looks much better<p>bigger is not better (sometimes) </TD></TR></TABLE><br>You mean the grill? Audi changed that now for good and that's the way it ought to stay.

Hornbag
02-07-2005, 01:11 AM
Dont worry RS, i like the A6 2! The new front is such an improvement, it adds a new diemention to the styling, that just says WOW!

knicks125
02-07-2005, 06:32 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>RS</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You mean the grill? Audi changed that now for good and that's the way it ought to stay.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Yep, the grille...even if i do get an audi, i would get the previous gen...i just don't like the front...just personal tastes...<p>Acutally I wouldn't get an audi anyway, I think it's too overpriced <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/beigesmilewinkgrin.gif" BORDER="0"> <BR><BR>
<i>Modified by knicks125 at 10:03 AM 2/10/2005</i>