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AM2
11-16-2005, 10:27 PM
<br><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">"The new Mercedes S class has a sophisticated radar-based braking system - when it works. A TV demonstration ended up in a 3-car pile-up when the S-class' safety radar failed.<p>A German television channel got a bigger scoop than they bargained for when Mercedes showed up with three of their flagship vehicles - only to crash them into each other when a safety demonstration failed.<p>Stern TV, who filmed the programme item slates the mistake, and compares it to the nasty falling-over tendency the early A-class Mercedes had.<p>Embarrassing mistake<p>In the programme, Mercedes drives 3 S-classes behind each other. The first car hits the brakes, and the two following cars brake down automatically, to avoid a crash. In theory. In practice, the first car braked, and the two others continued right into the back of each other, resulting in a 3-car pile-up at the test site.<p>According to a German news site, the blushing Mercedes security engineers soon discovered the problem: The test had been done in a hall which was made of steel. This confuses the radar, and the system doesn't work properly, causing more than £150,000 worth of cars to crumple into each other.<p>The system "works perfectly in all other circumstances", according to Mercedes. For now, though, it may be worth keeping your foot near the brake pedal." </TD></TR></TABLE><p>source: <A HREF="http://www.askaprice.com/torque-article.asp?article=Mercedes_makes_mess_of_safety_ demonstration&item=669" TARGET="_blank">http://www.askaprice.com/torqu...m=669</A> <br>

Hornbag
11-17-2005, 01:56 AM
LOL!!! All this expensive clutter added on just makes it heavy, its all not needed anyway.

Nath
11-17-2005, 03:22 AM
will it work in all tunnels? Is watching the traffic infront of you and paying attention to road conditions becoming old fashioned and unnecesssary?

Cozz
11-17-2005, 05:57 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Nath</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">will it work in all tunnels? Is watching the traffic infront of you and paying attention to road conditions becoming old fashioned and unnecesssary?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Paying attention in the road? C'mon man, that's old news. I don't even open my eyes when I drive. There's no need. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/driver.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Steel tunnels? Very hard to find here in the US. Funny thing is those guys didn't even bother pressing the brakes at all. The S-class has adaptive brakes as well. As soon as you tap the brakes, the car puts full force on them so it won't hit.

Reppu
11-17-2005, 07:19 AM
JAAAJAAJAAJJAAJAJAAJJAA!!!!! I could be laughin' all day!!!! That IS really embarrasing. Was the TV show live?

AM2
11-17-2005, 08:21 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Reppu</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">JAAAJAAJAAJJAAJAJAAJJAA!!!!! I could be laughin' all day!!!! That IS really embarrasing. Was the TV show live?</TD></TR></TABLE><br>I'm not sure if it was live, here's a photo taken from the video.<br><IMG SRC="http://www.askaprice.com/images/news/inhouse/669-03.jpg" BORDER="0">

Santeno
11-17-2005, 08:56 AM
anyone notice something odd in that picture?<p>The crash was strong enought the considerably deform the hood, yet obviously no airbags deployed. So which is it, is the airbag setting a bit high or is the hood a bit easy to crumple? I'm guessing it's the hood,since the rest of both cars seemms intact.

megadethmartyr
11-17-2005, 09:10 AM
That is the perfect system in theory for the guy that just too drunk to watch the road. Now get a system that takes over when he passes out and I'm in.

knicks125
11-17-2005, 12:51 PM
More pics:<p><A HREF="http://www.stern.de/tv/sterntv/549644.html?nv=cp_L2_" TARGET="_blank">http://www.stern.de/tv/sterntv...p_L2_</A><p>Crazy <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/cwm13.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Another reason why technology isn't the solution to everything, despite being better and faster...

Superfresa
11-17-2005, 05:38 PM
Ahahahah.... how embarassing....

Nodnarb
11-17-2005, 06:22 PM
I think the hood deforming as such is part of the pedestrian safety standards. I wonder if it beeing tested indoors has any bearing on why it malfunctioned. I know the system is supposed to work in tunnels, but this is an even smaller space than a tunnel.

Hornbag
11-18-2005, 04:11 AM
On a positive note, the S class does look really nice! Its styling has grown on me!

carjunkie
11-18-2005, 11:02 AM
Damn!, in the 10th and 11th picture you can see that S-class is crazy long.

Jordmaniac
11-18-2005, 02:26 PM
one of the dumb mistakes is that two of the cars arent even the 2007 s class! <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bonk.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bonk.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bonk.gif" BORDER="0">

galv
11-18-2005, 03:00 PM
<A HREF="http://www.stern.de/tv/sterntv/549719.html?backref=%2Ftv%2Fsterntv%2F549644.html% 3Fnv%3Dcp_L2_&nv=fs&cp=3" TARGET="_blank">http://www.stern.de/tv/sterntv...&cp=3</A> <p>why does this car have camo (fenders, tailights)

Ascariss
11-18-2005, 05:01 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>carjunkie</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Damn!, in the 10th and 11th picture you can see that S-class is crazy long.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Must be the LWB version then.<p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Jordmaniac</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">one of the dumb mistakes is that two of the cars arent even the 2007 s class! </TD></TR></TABLE><p>isn't it a 2006MY car? unless it's a 2007MY for NA.

Arturo
11-19-2005, 04:45 AM
Well, this makes things clear once again. Merc isn't a state-of-the-art brand anymore. You'd better be fiddling around with i-Drive (too much critized by technobetics) than crashing into your predecessor's car (thanks to the much acclaimed, but not functioning Merc technology).<p>Well what's good enough for taxi drivers, isn't simply good enough for other drivers.

Cozz
11-19-2005, 06:50 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Arturo</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well, this makes things clear once again. Merc isn't a state-of-the-art brand anymore. You'd better be fiddling around with i-Drive (too much critized by technobetics) than crashing into your predecessor's car (thanks to the much acclaimed, but not functioning Merc technology).<p>Well what's good enough for taxi drivers, isn't simply good enough for other drivers.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Maybe you're a little ahead of yourself. Many companies come out with some new techology then take it out of the market because it doesn't work right, lake of sales and other things. To say "Merc isn't a state-of-the-art brand anymore" is like saying "I can see you" blind folded.

AM2
11-19-2005, 07:29 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Maybe you're a little ahead of yourself. Many companies come out with some new techology then take it out of the market because it doesn't work right, lake of sales and other things. </TD></TR></TABLE><br>I guess its just been happening often lately, thats why some people feel like this towards Mercedes.<br>Not too long ago Daimler-Chrysler's CEO, Jurgen Schrempp got lost when the Navigation system of his Mercedes gave him wrong directions...

DSC-OFF
11-19-2005, 11:37 PM
Heres the video<p><A HREF="http://download.stern.de/_stream/NEBELCRASH_DSL.wmv" TARGET="_blank">http://download.stern.de/_stre...L.wmv</A>

Cozz
11-20-2005, 07:03 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>jesse</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Heres the video<p><A HREF="http://download.stern.de/_stream/NEBELCRASH_DSL.wmv" TARGET="_blank">http://download.stern.de/_stre...L.wmv</A></TD></TR></TABLE><p>This shows the full story. So the black one did break but not in time? What was the difference in the silver one? They tied it 3 times and worked all three times. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> <p>Nice car. I'm starting to like it more and more.

Wastl
11-20-2005, 09:39 AM
First of all: at the moment Mercedes says, that the system works correctly (also in tunnels), but in this hall, there is a problem because of the massive usage of steel. I think, in some weeks, we will know, if that's true.<p>So, in this demonstration a wooden board at the bottom instead of a beep should sign the driver (the chief editor of German car magazine Auto Bild!!!) when he should break. (Normally the braking assistent only supports the driver, when the sign warned him and he brakes; it doesn't brake of it's own!). <br>But he failed to break in time.<p>The system wasn't working not at all. <p>They repeated the demonstration and now, the driver used the brakes in time, after passing the boards.<br>But Mercedes forgot, that the driver had a switched on microphone, so the film team noticed, that the demonstration was only a show.

Cozz
11-20-2005, 10:09 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Wastl</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">First of all: at the moment Mercedes says, that the system works correctly (also in tunnels), but in this hall, there is a problem because of the massive usage of steel. I think, in some weeks, we will know, if that's true.<p>So, in this demonstration a wooden board at the bottom instead of a beep should sign the driver (the chief editor of German car magazine Auto Bild!!!) when he should break. (Normally the braking assistent only supports the driver, when the sign warned him and he brakes; it doesn't brake of it's own!). <br>But he failed to break in time.<p>The system wasn't working not at all. <p>They repeated the demonstration and now, the driver used the brakes in time, after passing the boards.<br>But Mercedes forgot, that the driver had a switched on microphone, so the film team noticed, that the demonstration was only a show.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Thanks. I think I understand now. So the break assist is like the older years but improved (give or take) and now it has a radar that tells the driver when to break. The older break assist only worked when you tapped the break. It would see how fast you are driving and how fast you hit the breaks. If needed, the system would add extra breaking. Pretty much the same but the new has a radar.

viper_rcr
11-28-2005, 10:43 AM
"Last weeks mishap involving a demonstration of Mercedes new radar-based automatic braking technology was not what it seemed. "<p>Apparently this AutoBild guy wanted the Mercedes boys to fake the demo so he could get an exclusive report. But he screwed it up and crashed the car. How mornonic. Typical Autobild....<p><A HREF="http://www.leftlanenews.com/?p=749" TARGET="_blank">http://www.leftlanenews.com/?p=749</A> <br>

bolita
11-28-2005, 12:29 PM
I wonder how much MB has lost in bad press due to this...and now it turns out it was "managed"? I would sue Auto Bild!!!

Chicho
11-30-2005, 10:53 AM
Well I'm trying to understand what Autobild journalist wanted to show us with that fake test.<p>And what about MB engineers that accept that faking?<p>

spwolf
11-30-2005, 06:47 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Thanks. I think I understand now. So the break assist is like the older years but improved (give or take) and now it has a radar that tells the driver when to break. The older break assist only worked when you tapped the break. It would see how fast you are driving and how fast you hit the breaks. If needed, the system would add extra breaking. Pretty much the same but the new has a radar.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>huh? NO. This is the most advertised feature of new S class, I am sure you are aware of it. Radar cruiser control is capable of working in any condition, and any speed. When set at cruise control, it can brake to dead stop and start again to desired speed. Pre-safe system is uses same radar to detect possible obstacles, and adjustes your braking power continiously. Now, while it might not matter for pre-safe, the fact that MB is using the same system for distronic cruise control, that should operate between 0 and 200 kmh, is very, very worrying.<p>What happened is that MB realized that due to metal in the walls, there was only 40% of the chance that system WILL WORK. So what they did is put an board on the line where driver should start braking, just to warn him in case car doesnt start screaming warning. What happened is that radar system noticed another car too late and did not apply enough force, so they crashed. Driver obviously did not brake over the board either.<p>Stern TV was not aware that MB intent was to fake the test due to system's inability to work. AutoBild reporter was. Stern TV reporter was denied permission to be in the car during the test. <p>Funniest thing that got them discovered is that Autobild reporter didnt know that his mike on the shirt was live, so he talked with MB guys and told them that he though that camera might see that car did not give out warning in time (wouldnt hear audible beeps). So this is when Stern TV noticed the board on the track, and started taping it.<p>When new S class came into line to take tests, it stopped a lot, lot sooner than before, due to driver braking over the board. Of course, all of this was carefully taped by Stern TV. Also, they taped MB employees secretly talking among themselves and hiding from TV cameras.<p>In Studio, DC manager apologized for not letting Stern TV know it is faked test and said that in normal traffic, system would work :-). And of course, system was engaged, it simply did not work.<p>This definetly wont help credibility of MB or Autobild - not only their system is ineffective and fails to work in certain conditions, they were willing to scam the public.

Cozz
11-30-2005, 08:16 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>huh? NO. This is the most advertised feature of new S class, I am sure you are aware of it. Radar cruiser control is capable of working in any condition, and any speed. When set at cruise control, it can brake to dead stop and start again to desired speed. Pre-safe system is uses same radar to detect possible obstacles, and adjustes your braking power continiously. Now, while it might not matter for pre-safe, the fact that MB is using the same system for distronic cruise control, that should operate between 0 and 200 kmh, is very, very worrying.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>I don't think it "adjusts your braking power". It adds extra breaking when needed. Such as how fast you press the breaks. It's a system that was on the older S-class. This is what I was talking about.<p>Another thing that you said (and some others) is that the piece of wood was there on the first run. Are you sure? Because I can't see in video unless I missed it. Although I did see it on the second run. Also, why is it "worrying" that the S-class uses the same system for different measures?

Chicho
12-01-2005, 04:59 PM
Thank you, now I understand the fake they're trrying to do. That's pathetic...

~*~STORM~*~
12-03-2005, 08:55 AM
the video is just damn funny!!<p>when the Auto Bild driver says "ScheiBe", he says "Sh*t"<p> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0"> <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/laugh2.gif" BORDER="0">

spwolf
12-04-2005, 04:38 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>I don't think it "adjusts your braking power". It adds extra breaking when needed. Such as how fast you press the breaks. It's a system that was on the older S-class. This is what I was talking about.<p>Another thing that you said (and some others) is that the piece of wood was there on the first run. Are you sure? Because I can't see in video unless I missed it. Although I did see it on the second run. Also, why is it "worrying" that the S-class uses the same system for different measures?</TD></TR></TABLE><p>it adjusts it, maintaining the distance between vehicles.... You should read about it from press materials.<p>And yes, board was always there. Thats what Stern TV said and what MB confirmed later on their show...MB knew already that it wont work.<p>What is worrying is that system is advertised to work 0-200kmh, and obviously if someone spends &gt;100k on S class, they might as well use it... which obviously they might not be safe to...

Cozz
12-04-2005, 08:36 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>What is worrying is that system is advertised to work 0-200kmh, and obviously if someone spends &gt;100k on S class, they might as well use it... which obviously they might not be safe to...</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Well, slow down there a minute. You're very biased. I'm willing to bet that you would defend Toyota if this happened to them. You would say something like a car driving in a small metal box isn't real world conditions. And so on.<p>...but since this isn't Toyota.<br>

Comrade
12-04-2005, 09:19 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>~*~STORM~*~</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>when the Auto Bild driver says "ScheiBe", he says "Sh*t"</TD></TR></TABLE><br>He was probably saying Scheisse because he knew it was his fault. Makes you think why would he curse over and over if it wasn't his fault <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> -It was.

T.B.
12-04-2005, 09:49 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>comrade</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>He was probably saying Scheisse because he knew it was his fault. Makes you think why would he curse over and over if it wasn't his fault <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/nixweiss.gif" BORDER="0"> -It was.</TD></TR></TABLE><p>No, the just system failed. It never warned the driver with a sound alert (to remind a driver to apply the brakes) as it should. The driver wore a mic which recorded no sound alert. In neither attempt. But they knew there would be no alert so they put a wooden board on a track to remind the driver when to apply the brakes. But the susspension was set too soft and the driver didn't feel he ran over the board. He applied the brakes only when he saw a car ahead - too late.<p>But the must problematic is that MB and AutoBild journalist tried to cover up the accident. Only SternTV's presence (their cameras and mics) gave them away. SternTV camerman wasn't allowed to be a passanger in the test car. MB said camerman's safty was the issue), but the real reason was they wanted to cover up the system wasn't working and giving no sound alerts.<p>Have MB paid journalist to lie in the cameras? He said the sound alert was present, but mic record showed otherwise: there were no alerts at all.<p>A fiasco for MB. And corrupted AutoBild as well (they fired the journalist as a scapegoat). <br> <BR><BR>
<i>Modified by Tine at 5:54 PM 12/4/2005</i>

creon448
12-04-2005, 05:27 PM
The system did not fail. The system was never on during any of the test and thus never sent an audible warning to the driver.

Cozz
12-04-2005, 06:23 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>creon448</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The system did not fail. The system was never on during any of the test and thus never sent an audible warning to the driver. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>How do you know? Are you saying that the system was never on to begin with?

spwolf
12-05-2005, 03:26 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Well, slow down there a minute. You're very biased. I'm willing to bet that you would defend Toyota if this happened to them. You would say something like a car driving in a small metal box isn't real world conditions. And so on.<p>...but since this isn't Toyota.<br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>I could tell you right now that toyota would never fake an test they knew it would fail. It really isnt part of Japanese culture.<p>And if they did, I would not defend them either. Besides, MB should have fired people responsible for this and thus clear their own name. Instead, they acted if it was minor inconvenience of getting caught. That made it worse, because it went from bad decision of one executive to bad decision of whole company.

Chicho
12-05-2005, 03:33 PM
I'm not sure about Japanese culture because I can remember Mitsubishi hiding information about problems in their cars and trucks for a long time. <p>It's a bit ironic MB left Mitsubishi because they fake infos, now it's MB

Cozz
12-05-2005, 07:26 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>I could tell you right now that toyota would never fake an test they knew it would fail. <b>It really isnt part of Japanese culture.</b></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Japanese culture? Mitsu doesn't ring a bell? How about the Honda sealbelt and lawsuit deal? This isn't about "Japanese culture". You can quit the BS from this point on. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0">

spwolf
12-10-2005, 03:44 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Japanese culture? Mitsu doesn't ring a bell? How about the Honda sealbelt and lawsuit deal? This isn't about "Japanese culture". You can quit the BS from this point on. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://images.zeroforum.com/smile/emthdown.gif" BORDER="0"> </TD></TR></TABLE><p>lol, i dont know whats the deal with you anymore, why blindly support MB for whatever they do? I work with Toyota (and HY), yet I know to criticize them when I see something wrong. In fact, Toyota likes criticism, it is only way to find your faults...

Cozz
12-10-2005, 07:03 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>lol, i dont know whats the deal with you anymore, why blindly support MB for whatever they do? I work with Toyota (and HY), yet I know to criticize them when I see something wrong. In fact, Toyota likes criticism, it is only way to find your faults...</TD></TR></TABLE><p>Me back up MB? You're smoking crack now. I have constantly attacked MB for a lot of things and a lot of cars. Maybe you should read the reviews I leave for the new MB cars. I think the last good review was the CLS. But you attack Toyota? Nope, for a guy that sais "Garmans are the last with everything"? That Toyota makes the best designs on the third row seating? C'mon now, I read everthing you write and a lot of crap don't make sense. I don't bother responding because I simply don't care. So what's the deal with me? I don't know, you're the one running around starting with me. Just look at some threads. But that's OK you can continue, not only am I not bothered by it, I enjoy every moment of it.<p>

rman5001
12-10-2005, 11:54 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>lol, i dont know whats the deal with you anymore, why blindly support MB for whatever they do? I work with Toyota (and HY), yet I know to criticize them when I see something wrong. In fact, Toyota likes criticism, it is only way to find your faults...</TD></TR></TABLE><p>If I recall correctly Toyota pulled all of their advertising from Road and Track a few years ago when none of their cars made the top 10 list. They didn't seem to like criticism then

spwolf
12-10-2005, 04:45 PM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>Cozz</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>Me back up MB? You're smoking crack now. I have constantly attacked MB for a lot of things and a lot of cars. Maybe you should read the reviews I leave for the new MB cars. I think the last good review was the CLS. But you attack Toyota? Nope, for a guy that sais "Garmans are the last with everything"? That Toyota makes the best designs on the third row seating? C'mon now, I read everthing you write and a lot of crap don't make sense. I don't bother responding because I simply don't care. So what's the deal with me? I don't know, you're the one running around starting with me. Just look at some threads. But that's OK you can continue, not only am I not bothered by it, I enjoy every moment of it.<p></TD></TR></TABLE><p>huh? I am running around starting with you? lol. When? I really dont care.<p>I am just saying that here is the company that openly wanted to deceive the public. They got on camera so there was an big scandal. You on the other hand only tried to excuse them for whatever reason.<p>Is it really that hard to say that MB was wrong? Instead blaming everyone else and saying its normal? :-).<p>If it was Toyota, there would be books written about it... and with reason too - germans and europeans on the other hand are much more known for their "tactics" so its not an huge deal, almost expected.

Naga Royal Guard
12-10-2005, 04:53 PM
MB will still make such a system before BMW dreams of it, that much is truth.

Cozz
12-11-2005, 07:04 AM
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote, originally posted by <b>spwolf</b> &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><p>huh? I am running around starting with you? lol. When? I really dont care. </TD></TR></TABLE><p>Look at this and other threads and you'll see. Check out the Dodge hybrid thread as well. There's been many others before that. You'll put in your 2 cents against whatever I say. Not that I mind cause I don't. Besides, it gives me a chance to throw my 2 cents back at you some day. <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bangin.gif" BORDER="0"> <p><TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD><i>Quote &raquo;</i></TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><br>I am just saying that here is the company that openly wanted to deceive the public. They got on camera so there was an big scandal. <b> You on the other hand only tried to excuse them for whatever reason.<p>Is it really that hard to say that MB was wrong? Instead blaming everyone else and saying its normal? :-). </b><br></TD></TR></TABLE><p>Sorry dude but I didn't excuse anyone. I was actually asking questions because I didn't understand what was going on. I never tried to blame anyone else nor did I try to move the blame from MB. I simply wanted to know what was going on. You should start from the first page and you'll notice I have a point there.

velsatis
12-11-2005, 07:18 AM
Guys....kill yourselfs in PM....Kind of off-topic your conversation.<p>Anyway, my opinion, yes there was a fail from someone in MB by simulating or whatever that happened over here.<br>Personaly, I had the luck to see and later (for all my joy) try the system.<br>MB had a bunch of S-Klass to try out I tryed one randomly (black....I just love it in that color) and try to throw myself against my fathers Golf, of course I tryied it doing 50kms at first (first time is always first time and I don't want my dad to <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bangin.gif" BORDER="0"> me...lol) second time we did it at faster speed (sorry wasn't looking how much) I was just enjoying a wonder of tecknology and I though "how can someone crash with this car!!!" if someone crushes against me, ok not much to do, but its perfect, it just brakes, closes the widows, thightens the belt and you fell like in a safe where nothing will touch you......<br>before the critics, just try it, there are no words <IMG NAME="icon" SRC="http://www.germancarfans.com/images/forums/bowdown.gif" BORDER="0"> <br>